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Post by bois on Sept 13, 2010 9:02:07 GMT -4
Played in France last year, in fact he and Guenette were 1-2 in scoring for Briancon. There are a few others from the QMHJL that played there last year, some of them were considered top end players as well and they also did not have much of a pro career, so just maybe the the flops of the Bernier/Guenette as pro players does not "pretty much puts to bed the debate between Hali and CB fans on what they were made of"  Those guys are STILL playing together?! Man, they never leave each others' side..... it's almost cute. ;D I know that many former top-end Q players are playing in obscure European leagues these days, but I doubt many of them were high 2nd round NHL picks like Bernier was.  He was touted as a "power forward" because of his size, but in reality the guy could have played without shoulder pads. I've never seen a less impressive "star" player from the Q than FP Guenette... his lack of any solid pro career doesn't surprise me even a bit... what a leach that kid was |
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Post by mikeb on Sept 13, 2010 10:41:57 GMT -4
Many people are predicting the Eagles to miss the playoffs. Others have them pencilled into the last few spots, only because of other teams who seem to have been incredibly mis-managed (see: Rouyn-Noranda). I think I'd classify myself as one of the optimists, and even with that optimist view I still don't see this team anywhere near Mario Durocher's stated (and ridiculous) goal of having home ice in round 1. I think people might be selling the Eagles short though, if they think they are a lock to win the division. Here's a rundown of the roster, and who I think has the potential to have better than expected seasons. (I won't go through every player. For example, a guy like Viktor Hertzberg- he's a player fans of other teams recognise as being a legit scoring forward who will likely improve. Taylor MacDougal is another guy who I think is "you see is what you get"- a secondary scorer thrust into a first line role...most players in his shoes produce similar numbers to their 19 year old season.) As for the rest (I'll do the forwards for now)... Stephen Horyl- I think he may be very underrated in terms of his abilities, both because of his late entry into the Q and his injury problems. In my opinion, if he's healthy, he can score 35 goals in a season. Key word- IF he's healthy. I don't doubt his talent, but unfortunately this season I think we're bound to see plenty of nights where he's either on the sidelines or clearly not playing at 100%. Brad Cuzner- Fans outside CB may be surprised to know that he was voted fan's choice last year. Playing out west in midget allowed him to fly under the radar- the Eagles were going off the board to pick him but they defintely got value for where he was picked. They may get even more value. When evaluating 17 year old players, you can't just look at points alone. Cuzner works hard and had his fair share of chances to score last year. He's a player, to me, who could go either way... either somewhat sputter and put up similar numbers to last year, or have somewhat of an explosion and prove to be a genuine second line player in the Q. I'll predict he surprises people offensively, but falls a bit short of being a true top 6 forward- yet. Logan Shaw- Everyone knew the Eagles were stretching when they took Logan in round 1 in 2008. The fact that anyone would take him that early would indicate there's SOME offensive upside there, but there wasn't enough progress there last year for most people's liking. Shaw is bit simliar to Cuzner in terms of ceiling for offense this year- but I personally think his odds of becoming a true second liner this year are longer than Cuzner's, and he's not as an effective player without the puck either. That being said, it's too early to write him off... I wouldn't be surprised if he ends up being somewhat of a poor man's Scott Brannon, breaking out at 19. Cory MacIntosh- MacIntosh was the pleasant surprise of last year's Eagles squad, battling the odds as an 11th round pick to become a very useful lower end forward who's defensively accountable. He seems to have enough talent and offensive awareness that he should have some upside- however, I think 2nd line is absolute max in terms of potential and that would be much later in his Q career. Odds are that MacIntosh stays an effective, albeit somewhat low scoring 3rd line player this season. P-A Dion- Dion is someone who likely has high expectations from Mario Durocher this season. While eveyone knows about the insanely high price paid for Jacob Lagace, it shouldn't be hard to believe- he WAS one of the offensive league leaders and usually guys like that cost an arm & a leg. However, paying Francis Meiuller (and Lapostelle) for Dion seemed ridicuous at the time and even more so now after the second half Dion had here in CB. It's strange- he had very good numbers in Montreal, but in Cape Breton, not only did he not produce, he didn't look like he had ANY hands at all. Dion is a hard working player, but couldn't find the back of the net here last season. But he obviously he has the tools- 10 goals in 37 games in Montreal is very good production. He may be the biggest wildcard this year. He will obviously be given every opportunity on a scoring line. Which P-A Dion will show up this year? I honestly have no idea, but based on what I physically saw last year I can't imagine this guy being a scoring presence. We'll see. Vincent Plouffe - Plouffe is an interesting case study because he's an 18 year old rookie who apparently could have played in the league last year (Durocher wanted him to come up after Christmas but he declined). Given that, can he play like a second year player and seriously challenge for 2nd line ice time on a rebuilding team? Or will he be like many rookies and be fighting just to stay in the lineup? He looked great in all intrasquad & exhibition, but I'm not sure how those skills will translate into regular season action. I predict he'll be at least a regular for the Eagles this season but I don't know if we'll get any significant offensive contributions. Felix Bergeron- Bergeron is an 18 year old who might as well be a rookie, as he barely saw the ice last season. I can't say I've seen ANY significant upside from this guy... but yet it wouldn't shock me if he turned out to be a pleasant surprise, just because he's been given so little of a chance, who knows what he'll do with actual icetime. More than likely though I think he'll be just fighting for time in the lineup. THE ROOKIES- I'll group them all together, I'll include Parker in here since he didn't play that much last year. I don't think we have any bluechippers in the mix here, except perhaps Jodoin and William Carrier (10 goal seasons a possibility for those guys??), with the latter being only 16. However, if they each play a bit above expectation it will be a huge boost to the team... just look at the rookie core from 04-05, none put up true scorer's numbers but if they all chip in a bit of offense it will ease the pain. RN made it to the President's Cup 3 years ago and made the 2nd round last year. If that is mismanaged, what does that make CB. Nearly everyone of the players you mentioned is surrounded by your questionmarks. Seems like a lot of wishful thinking/hopeful finger crossing. It seems like a last place team from your post. Any expectation of finishing out of the basement better come from your 2nd post. Edit: after reading your 2nd post, I'm totally convinced CB is a last place team. |
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Post by CrazyJoeDavola on Sept 13, 2010 11:08:34 GMT -4
Those guys are STILL playing together?! Man, they never leave each others' side..... it's almost cute. ;D I know that many former top-end Q players are playing in obscure European leagues these days, but I doubt many of them were high 2nd round NHL picks like Bernier was. He was touted as a "power forward" because of his size, but in reality the guy could have played without shoulder pads. I've never seen a less impressive "star" player from the Q than FP Guenette... his lack of any solid pro career doesn't surprise me even a bit... what a leach that kid was Leach off of who? In Halifax he was a very good player for us. He led us and CB in scoring. He certainly wasnt a cant miss pro prospect but he still put up decent numbers in the ECHL, finishing 4th-6th in team scoring each year. He always seemed to produce in the playoffs (04 excluded) too with some clutch goals. You won`t find many in Halifax thinking he was a leach... he was a solid player with good skill... capable of scoring with an individual effort or setting up teammates. |
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Post by Clubber Lang on Sept 13, 2010 11:58:41 GMT -4
Just makes it much worse knowing you will finish in the bottom 5 and you won't even get a pick in the first round next year. Halifax loaded up and got Marchand but they did restock their cupboards by trading the sack of shit macmillan for picks etc. I don't think there is a team in the Q right now in as bad of shape as the eagles are for talent and potential picks. I bet you that Gormley gets traded this year at X mas to a contender and it will be a similar trade like Bourdon for Marchand and Samson if he returns. Who was the other guy that went to valdor that year?
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Post by Jack Bauer on Sept 13, 2010 14:36:08 GMT -4
Just makes it much worse knowing you will finish in the bottom 5 and you won't even get a pick in the first round next year. Halifax loaded up and got Marchand but they did restock their cupboards by trading the sack of shit macmillan for picks etc. I don't think there is a team in the Q right now in as bad of shape as the eagles are for talent and potential picks. I bet you that Gormley gets traded this year at X mas to a contender and it will be a similar trade like Bourdon for Marchand and Samson if he returns. Who was the other guy that went to valdor that year? You'll be crying yourself to sleep at night if you start looking back at how others have cashed in on their stars.....and thanks to Durocher Jacob Lagace will now be on that list as well. We're .500 right now though....well on our way to that top 8 finish Mario spoke of....we do play Halifax 33 or so more times, right?  |
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Post by Jack Bauer on Sept 13, 2010 14:46:24 GMT -4
Many people are predicting the Eagles to miss the playoffs. Others have them pencilled into the last few spots, only because of other teams who seem to have been incredibly mis-managed (see: Rouyn-Noranda). I think I'd classify myself as one of the optimists, and even with that optimist view I still don't see this team anywhere near Mario Durocher's stated (and ridiculous) goal of having home ice in round 1. I think people might be selling the Eagles short though, if they think they are a lock to win the division. Here's a rundown of the roster, and who I think has the potential to have better than expected seasons. (I won't go through every player. For example, a guy like Viktor Hertzberg- he's a player fans of other teams recognise as being a legit scoring forward who will likely improve. Taylor MacDougal is another guy who I think is "you see is what you get"- a secondary scorer thrust into a first line role...most players in his shoes produce similar numbers to their 19 year old season.) As for the rest (I'll do the forwards for now)... Stephen Horyl- I think he may be very underrated in terms of his abilities, both because of his late entry into the Q and his injury problems. In my opinion, if he's healthy, he can score 35 goals in a season. Key word- IF he's healthy. I don't doubt his talent, but unfortunately this season I think we're bound to see plenty of nights where he's either on the sidelines or clearly not playing at 100%. Brad Cuzner- Fans outside CB may be surprised to know that he was voted fan's choice last year. Playing out west in midget allowed him to fly under the radar- the Eagles were going off the board to pick him but they defintely got value for where he was picked. They may get even more value. When evaluating 17 year old players, you can't just look at points alone. Cuzner works hard and had his fair share of chances to score last year. He's a player, to me, who could go either way... either somewhat sputter and put up similar numbers to last year, or have somewhat of an explosion and prove to be a genuine second line player in the Q. I'll predict he surprises people offensively, but falls a bit short of being a true top 6 forward- yet. Logan Shaw- Everyone knew the Eagles were stretching when they took Logan in round 1 in 2008. The fact that anyone would take him that early would indicate there's SOME offensive upside there, but there wasn't enough progress there last year for most people's liking. Shaw is bit simliar to Cuzner in terms of ceiling for offense this year- but I personally think his odds of becoming a true second liner this year are longer than Cuzner's, and he's not as an effective player without the puck either. That being said, it's too early to write him off... I wouldn't be surprised if he ends up being somewhat of a poor man's Scott Brannon, breaking out at 19. Cory MacIntosh- MacIntosh was the pleasant surprise of last year's Eagles squad, battling the odds as an 11th round pick to become a very useful lower end forward who's defensively accountable. He seems to have enough talent and offensive awareness that he should have some upside- however, I think 2nd line is absolute max in terms of potential and that would be much later in his Q career. Odds are that MacIntosh stays an effective, albeit somewhat low scoring 3rd line player this season. P-A Dion- Dion is someone who likely has high expectations from Mario Durocher this season. While eveyone knows about the insanely high price paid for Jacob Lagace, it shouldn't be hard to believe- he WAS one of the offensive league leaders and usually guys like that cost an arm & a leg. However, paying Francis Meiuller (and Lapostelle) for Dion seemed ridicuous at the time and even more so now after the second half Dion had here in CB. It's strange- he had very good numbers in Montreal, but in Cape Breton, not only did he not produce, he didn't look like he had ANY hands at all. Dion is a hard working player, but couldn't find the back of the net here last season. But he obviously he has the tools- 10 goals in 37 games in Montreal is very good production. He may be the biggest wildcard this year. He will obviously be given every opportunity on a scoring line. Which P-A Dion will show up this year? I honestly have no idea, but based on what I physically saw last year I can't imagine this guy being a scoring presence. We'll see. Vincent Plouffe - Plouffe is an interesting case study because he's an 18 year old rookie who apparently could have played in the league last year (Durocher wanted him to come up after Christmas but he declined). Given that, can he play like a second year player and seriously challenge for 2nd line ice time on a rebuilding team? Or will he be like many rookies and be fighting just to stay in the lineup? He looked great in all intrasquad & exhibition, but I'm not sure how those skills will translate into regular season action. I predict he'll be at least a regular for the Eagles this season but I don't know if we'll get any significant offensive contributions. Felix Bergeron- Bergeron is an 18 year old who might as well be a rookie, as he barely saw the ice last season. I can't say I've seen ANY significant upside from this guy... but yet it wouldn't shock me if he turned out to be a pleasant surprise, just because he's been given so little of a chance, who knows what he'll do with actual icetime. More than likely though I think he'll be just fighting for time in the lineup. THE ROOKIES- I'll group them all together, I'll include Parker in here since he didn't play that much last year. I don't think we have any bluechippers in the mix here, except perhaps Jodoin and William Carrier (10 goal seasons a possibility for those guys??), with the latter being only 16. However, if they each play a bit above expectation it will be a huge boost to the team... just look at the rookie core from 04-05, none put up true scorer's numbers but if they all chip in a bit of offense it will ease the pain. RN made it to the President's Cup 3 years ago and made the 2nd round last year. If that is mismanaged, what does that make CB. Nearly everyone of the players you mentioned is surrounded by your questionmarks. Seems like a lot of wishful thinking/hopeful finger crossing. It seems like a last place team from your post. Any expectation of finishing out of the basement better come from your 2nd post. Edit: after reading your 2nd post, I'm totally convinced CB is a last place team. The only way we don't look mismanaged is when we ignore the success of a good dozen teams and compare ourselves to the other weak sisters who we've managed to squeak out slightly more playoff success then over the last few years and of course the banner raising over .500 regular seasons we're famous for. It's been nothing but downhill since Vincent left, yet we keep helping him build his new team and get nothing but insulting lip service from our own team who seems to now be operating under their own self evaluations. |
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Post by Clubber Lang on Sept 13, 2010 17:19:33 GMT -4
Just makes it much worse knowing you will finish in the bottom 5 and you won't even get a pick in the first round next year. Halifax loaded up and got Marchand but they did restock their cupboards by trading the sack of shit macmillan for picks etc. I don't think there is a team in the Q right now in as bad of shape as the eagles are for talent and potential picks. I bet you that Gormley gets traded this year at X mas to a contender and it will be a similar trade like Bourdon for Marchand and Samson if he returns. Who was the other guy that went to valdor that year? You'll be crying yourself to sleep at night if you start looking back at how others have cashed in on their stars.....and thanks to Durocher Jacob Lagace will now be on that list as well. We're .500 right now though....well on our way to that top 8 finish Mario spoke of....we do play Halifax 33 or so more times, right? I love how Pascal built his team this year. I am just wondering if he or Durocher really have or had control? Montreal is set up very nicely to take a major run this year and they will be adding at the deadline. Mark my words! |
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Post by Reesor on Sept 13, 2010 20:14:43 GMT -4
The GMs and scouts play the biggest part in building up a team for a run, just like in any level of sport. But a lot of it is luck as well.
Can you imagine the draft picks/prospects Halifax would have got if Marchand, Voracek, Corsi, Bondarchuk and Hillier all returned for the 08/09 season? If we were able to trade Marchand and/or Voracek alone at the 08/09 trade deadline our rebuilding would be at least 1 year quicker. Even taking into consideration that we would've been better in 09/10 and we wouldn't have gotten frk, Ciampini etc.
With Bathurst and Saint John in a league of their own, it would be wise of Moncton to hold a firesale at this years deadline. They have a ton of assets they could trade. Who wouldn't want Kabanov? ;D
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Post by Clubber Lang on Sept 13, 2010 21:20:04 GMT -4
The GMs and scouts play the biggest part in building up a team for a run, just like in any level of sport. But a lot of it is luck as well. Can you imagine the draft picks/prospects Halifax would have got if Marchand, Voracek, Corsi, Bondarchuk and Hillier all returned for the 08/09 season? If we were able to trade Marchand and/or Voracek alone at the 08/09 trade deadline our rebuilding would be at least 1 year quicker. Even taking into consideration that we would've been better in 09/10 and we wouldn't have gotten frk, Ciampini etc. With Bathurst and Saint John in a league of their own, it would be wise of Moncton to hold a firesale at this years deadline. They have a ton of assets they could trade. Who wouldn't want Kabanov? ;D Saint John! Jurco and Galiev aren't moving for a Kabanov. |
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Post by Deer on Sept 13, 2010 21:34:28 GMT -4
The GMs and scouts play the biggest part in building up a team for a run, just like in any level of sport. But a lot of it is luck as well. Can you imagine the draft picks/prospects Halifax would have got if Marchand, Voracek, Corsi, Bondarchuk and Hillier all returned for the 08/09 season? If we were able to trade Marchand and/or Voracek alone at the 08/09 trade deadline our rebuilding would be at least 1 year quicker. Even taking into consideration that we would've been better in 09/10 and we wouldn't have gotten frk, Ciampini etc. With Bathurst and Saint John in a league of their own, it would be wise of Moncton to hold a firesale at this years deadline. They have a ton of assets they could trade. Who wouldn't want Kabanov? ;D Saint John! Jurco and Galiev aren't moving for a Kabanov. Someone must have flipped the "off" switch on your sarcasm meter. ;D |
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Post by Deer on Sept 13, 2010 21:37:42 GMT -4
You'll be crying yourself to sleep at night if you start looking back at how others have cashed in on their stars.....and thanks to Durocher Jacob Lagace will now be on that list as well. We're .500 right now though....well on our way to that top 8 finish Mario spoke of....we do play Halifax 33 or so more times, right? I love how Pascal built his team this year. I am just wondering if he or Durocher really have or had control? Montreal is set up very nicely to take a major run this year and they will be adding at the deadline. Mark my words! I too love the character veterans PV has assembled on that Montreal team..... Fontaine, Chouinard, and Meilleur = all guys I for one loved as Eagles and obviously Vincent did too. In fact all three of his 20s are guys he had in his last year in Cape Breton - Chouinard, Meilleur, Gouchie. Guys that were part of that ultra hard-working/overachieving 07-08 team. All of that said, there's more pressure on Montreal this year than on any team in the entire league. And the media circus around Louis Leblanc will be a difficult distraction to overcome. Even if the makeup of the Junior looks good, how will they handle this large intangible factor of all this pressure and attention? We don't need a reminder of how the last P Vincent team with this kind of "Pres Cup favourites" expectations panned out. |
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Post by brec7 on Sept 14, 2010 9:47:27 GMT -4
RN made it to the President's Cup 3 years ago and made the 2nd round last year. If that is mismanaged, what does that make CB. True enough... I don't think I chose words well as RN over the years has been managed quite well if you look at the consistency of their record. But then again, so has Cape Breton. What I meant was what they have coming back in terms of assets this year. CB doesn't have much of a returning core itself, but RN has REMARKABLY little. Also, for comparison's sake, CB was a 2nd round team calibre last year if not for the playoff format. Don't mistake me for a homer when it comes to how this team was handled last year at the deadline... there's just no need to rehash it when evaluating this season, since it's already been explained (and explained well) by other posters on here. Going for it last year was obviously boneheaded (and I'm sure I said as such at the time). But what I dispute is that CB is a LOCK to finish last... on paper they have the worst roster, but they're not so far back on paper that a few things couldn't vault them ahead of another team in the Maritimes. The standings RARELY, if EVER, go exactly as the "experts" predict. Nearly everyone of the players you mentioned is surrounded by your questionmarks. Seems like a lot of wishful thinking/hopeful finger crossing. Well, that was the entire point of the post! To measure max and minimum expectations to a reasonable level with each player. I don't think any of the evaluations were far off. Edit: after reading your 2nd post, I'm totally convinced CB is a last place team. It's hard for me to trust your judgement on this team considering during Mario's first year as coach here, you said that "Cape Breton finishing 500 is dreaming in technicolour." Pretty sure Jack Bauer has that one bookmarked. ;D As for comments from others about how the team has fared since Pascal has left... one could argue that it's PASCAL'S philosophy when he was here that caught up to the team. Since the trading deadline in 2002 he didn't ever sell even when he had the chance to. I would not have been surprised at all to hear, if he was still here coaching last season, Pascal at the deadline spew off the cliches about how we weren't a selling/rebuilding team, blah blah. That's all we saw from him during other years the team should have sold. What I won't dispute, though, is that Pascal was better at managing assets than Mario is. (And that shouldn't be a surprise- us Eagles fans who wanted PV gone were never hard on him for his ability to get value in a trade, but rather his coaching and the direction he pointed the team in with said trades.) What Pascal did well (aside from assembling a great scouting staff) was avoid overpayment, and peddle excess players here and there for draft picks that added up, creating depth to cushion the fall in down years. If he was still here we'd likely have a stronger team this year- but not likely a contender, and the lack of selling vets would eventually catch up. We'll see how he handles his strong Junior squad this season. |
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Post by Clubber Lang on Sept 14, 2010 11:46:54 GMT -4
Saint John! Jurco and Galiev aren't moving for a Kabanov. Someone must have flipped the "off" switch on your sarcasm meter. ;D Thanks Deer! I am being good this year |
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Post by mikeb on Sept 14, 2010 12:29:08 GMT -4
RN made it to the President's Cup 3 years ago and made the 2nd round last year. If that is mismanaged, what does that make CB. True enough... I don't think I chose words well as RN over the years has been managed quite well if you look at the consistency of their record. But then again, so has Cape Breton. What I meant was what they have coming back in terms of assets this year. CB doesn't have much of a returning core itself, but RN has REMARKABLY little. Also, for comparison's sake, CB was a 2nd round team calibre last year if not for the playoff format. Don't mistake me for a homer when it comes to how this team was handled last year at the deadline... there's just no need to rehash it when evaluating this season, since it's already been explained (and explained well) by other posters on here. Going for it last year was obviously boneheaded (and I'm sure I said as such at the time). But what I dispute is that CB is a LOCK to finish last... on paper they have the worst roster, but they're not so far back on paper that a few things couldn't vault them ahead of another team in the Maritimes. The standings RARELY, if EVER, go exactly as the "experts" predict. Well, that was the entire point of the post! To measure max and minimum expectations to a reasonable level with each player. I don't think any of the evaluations were far off. Edit: after reading your 2nd post, I'm totally convinced CB is a last place team. It's hard for me to trust your judgement on this team considering during Mario's first year as coach here, you said that "Cape Breton finishing 500 is dreaming in technicolour." Pretty sure Jack Bauer has that one bookmarked. ;D As for comments from others about how the team has fared since Pascal has left... one could argue that it's PASCAL'S philosophy when he was here that caught up to the team. Since the trading deadline in 2002 he didn't ever sell even when he had the chance to. I would not have been surprised at all to hear, if he was still here coaching last season, Pascal at the deadline spew off the cliches about how we weren't a selling/rebuilding team, blah blah. That's all we saw from him during other years the team should have sold. What I won't dispute, though, is that Pascal was better at managing assets than Mario is. (And that shouldn't be a surprise- us Eagles fans who wanted PV gone were never hard on him for his ability to get value in a trade, but rather his coaching and the direction he pointed the team in with said trades.) What Pascal did well (aside from assembling a great scouting staff) was avoid overpayment, and peddle excess players here and there for draft picks that added up, creating depth to cushion the fall in down years. If he was still here we'd likely have a stronger team this year- but not likely a contender, and the lack of selling vets would eventually catch up. We'll see how he handles his strong Junior squad this season. I think it was Murph that recently brought up my post where I said that CB would be fighting for last place last season. Of course all you guys have conveniently neglected that the post was made at season's end before the draft and I did say that CB would be trading down and they would be rebuilding. In hindsight, CB should have followed my thoughts. Instead of trading for Luke and others, think of where the S. Eagles would be sitting now if they traded their veterans at the draft and Christmas like I thought they would. |
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Post by brec7 on Sept 14, 2010 13:17:17 GMT -4
THAT we can all agree on!  |
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He was touted as a "power forward" because of his size, but in reality the guy could have played without shoulder pads.
