|
2015-16
Jan 26, 2015 19:46:35 GMT -4
Post by Captain Obvious on Jan 26, 2015 19:46:35 GMT -4
In 2006 it was a serious run and lost in championship final. You think Irving is gonna wait for another 10 years ,that will be 20. 5 yrs ago wasn't the 2006 team in any shape or form. Don't hold your breath on this new facility yet The Cats won't get the Memorial Cup in the Coliseum.
|
|
|
2015-16
Jan 27, 2015 10:14:15 GMT -4
Post by npsh on Jan 27, 2015 10:14:15 GMT -4
In 2006 it was a serious run and lost in championship final. You think Irving is gonna wait for another 10 years ,that will be 20. 5 yrs ago wasn't the 2006 team in any shape or form. Don't hold your breath on this new facility yet The Cats won't get the Memorial Cup in the Coliseum. Perhaps, perhaps not. Over the years when the Q hosted the Memorial Cup I dare say some of the venues were a hell of a lot worse than the Coliseum. For obvious reasons Saint John and Halifax would be ideal spots here in Maritimes. And, yes the Coliseum certainly needs updating but it will be interesting to see within the next few years if those big plans for the new complex will bear fruit with the fiscal situation for the Province of NB.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
2015-16
Jan 27, 2015 10:52:42 GMT -4
Post by Deleted on Jan 27, 2015 10:52:42 GMT -4
In 2006 it was a serious run and lost in championship final. You think Irving is gonna wait for another 10 years ,that will be 20. 5 yrs ago wasn't the 2006 team in any shape or form. Don't hold your breath on this new facility yet The Cats won't get the Memorial Cup in the Coliseum. WOW. I actually agree with you for once. Moncton won't get another Memorial Cup until the new rink is built downtown. I see us bidding the first year the Q is hosting after it's opening.
|
|
|
2015-16
Jan 27, 2015 11:14:04 GMT -4
Post by Captain Obvious on Jan 27, 2015 11:14:04 GMT -4
The Cats won't get the Memorial Cup in the Coliseum. WOW. I actually agree with you for once. Moncton won't get another Memorial Cup until the new rink is built downtown. I see us bidding the first year the Q is hosting after it's opening. Exactly, as soon as the new rink is ready you'll see them agressively going after the prospects' game, Subway Super series and Memorial Cup.
|
|
|
2015-16
Jan 27, 2015 12:09:38 GMT -4
Post by SteveUL on Jan 27, 2015 12:09:38 GMT -4
WOW. I actually agree with you for once. Moncton won't get another Memorial Cup until the new rink is built downtown. I see us bidding the first year the Q is hosting after it's opening. Exactly, as soon as the new rink is ready you'll see them agressively going after the prospects' game, Subway Super series and Memorial Cup. I don't think we'll get the Mem Cup before Halifax and Saint John. If we assume that one of them gets the next (after Quebec) Q hosted Mem Cup ... then we'll be 6 years after that. I know it will come down to many factors ... but mainly team strength ... and both teams will be positioning for either opportunities. It all depends on when our new rink is completed ... and if it ever gets off the ground. The Feds are on-board (in an election year ... surprise) ... somewhat ... but they have put it all in the lap of the Province saying "if they are in, we are in"(a political move by the Federal conservatives to make the Provincial Liberals look bad). With our recent auditor report for the Province, it will be a tough sell for Gallant to pony up their share of the money for a rink when they have to cut everything to the bone just to make a small dent in the deficit. The Liberals will never get re-elected if all they do is cut and cut to try to manage the deficit ... so they have to bring in some occasional good news with most of the bad. Adding a rink to Moncton ... usually a Liberal strong hold ... is a way to add some good news. But it may not happen for a few more years as we are 3+ years away from the next provincial election.
|
|
|
2015-16
Jan 27, 2015 13:54:33 GMT -4
Post by npsh on Jan 27, 2015 13:54:33 GMT -4
I don't think a government of whatever political stripe will pony up some millions of dollars for a new rink here in Moncton if they are faced with closing down some rural/regional health care facilities as has been noted in paper other day. You can hear the argument (right or wrong) now why NB tax payers should contribute towards a new facility to support a hockey team owned by the Irvings when there is already an arena here that basically meets the needs. There are more pressing needs here in NB than a new rink for Moncton so the argument will go.
|
|
|
2015-16
Jan 27, 2015 15:24:28 GMT -4
Post by SteveUL on Jan 27, 2015 15:24:28 GMT -4
I don't think a government of whatever political stripe will pony up some millions of dollars for a new rink here in Moncton if they are faced with closing down some rural/regional health care facilities as has been noted in paper other day. You can hear the argument (right or wrong) now why NB tax payers should contribute towards a new facility to support a hockey team owned by the Irvings when there is already an arena here that basically meets the needs. There are more pressing needs here in NB than a new rink for Moncton so the argument will go. The last Provincial government had already promised the contribution ... as part of their election promises. Closing hospitals shuts down maintenance needs and daily/monthly/annual costs associated. It is a long term and recurring savings. Paying a lump sum payment into a new facility that won't be Provincially/Federally owned or maintained ... but is potentially an economic generator for the region ... is an apples to oranges comparison. Provincially owned buildings are nothing but a drag on the government coffers ... while non-government buildings generate tax dollars for the Province. The Coliseum becomes a full time trade show facility which is an economic catalyst ... and the new events center draws in acts and events that we were unable to attract with the Coliseum. There is a business argument to made for it ... the more business they do the more tax dollars they generate. It is still a hard sell in these economic times ... I don't argue that. At some point, Mr. Irving is going to have to bring some influence to the table to make it happen.
|
|
|
2015-16
Jan 27, 2015 18:24:02 GMT -4
Post by npsh on Jan 27, 2015 18:24:02 GMT -4
SteveUL Yes, points noted in your second paragraph are certainly valid - there's no question.I also share your view this new complex will be a very difficult sell in the current fiscal environment regardless what was promised in the last Provincial election. Then again , maybe this facility has been bargained for and is a go which no doubt would be a big shot in the arm to Moncton and surrounding area as you outlined in your third paragraph. However, I won't be putting a down payment on Cats seasons tickets in the proposed new facility yet Here's hoping we do get to host a Memorial Cup with a competitive team at some future date. Best NPSH
|
|
|
Post by jimmy on Jan 27, 2015 20:22:01 GMT -4
The difficulty with the province investing money at the current time in a downtown centre is primarily one of political perception in my opinion. The reality is, the economy in the Moncton area is completely different than that of the province as a whole ... We have strong economic growth, younger demographics, and higher disposable incomes than the province as a whole - in short it is the type of environment in which government would be entirely justified to invest in a large project to capitalize on the opportunity to throw more fuel in the engine and generate even more activity. By contrast, most of the rest o the province is in long term decline, and simply cannot sustain the level of services they currently have. Viewed independently, there are very valid cases to invest in Moncton while cutting elsewhere - but the optics of doing that will be tough politically. Moncton may be forced to do without so that our local tax base can subsidize the poorer regions of the province and minimize their pain.
|
|
|
2015-16
Jan 27, 2015 21:39:32 GMT -4
Post by chsb on Jan 27, 2015 21:39:32 GMT -4
I would argue that there are other revenue generating potential investment to be made in the regions which would generate as much revenue for the government.
One has only to think of the mine openings forecasted for the next 2-3 years which would create high paying jobs with a high tax rate and also royalties....we never got back in the Chaleur region the taxes paid by the miners along the last 49 years...
The NB Government has been a milk cow for Moncton for quite a while already.
|
|
|
2015-16
Jan 27, 2015 21:49:29 GMT -4
Post by npsh on Jan 27, 2015 21:49:29 GMT -4
The difficulty with the province investing money at the current time in a downtown centre is primarily one of political perception in my opinion. The reality is, the economy in the Moncton area is completely different than that of the province as a whole ... We have strong economic growth, younger demographics, and higher disposable incomes than the province as a whole - in short it is the type of environment in which government would be entirely justified to invest in a large project to capitalize on the opportunity to throw more fuel in the engine and generate even more activity. By contrast, most of the rest o the province is in long term decline, and simply cannot sustain the level of services they currently have. Viewed independently, there are very valid cases to invest in Moncton while cutting elsewhere - but the optics of doing that will be tough politically. Moncton may be forced to do without so that our local tax base can subsidize the poorer regions of the province and minimize their pain. It is always an issue urban vs rural when it comes to "level of service" be it adding or closing facilities. NB is no different than my home Province NL in this regard, I suspect PE and NS are similar. Putting economics aside, you are correct in that politics will be the deciding factor if it hasn't happened already. I do believe the argument from the "outsiders" will be along the line this facility will be mainly for hockey, the tennent being Moncton Wildcats who are owned by JD Irving who has vast resources and let them(JDI) anti up not the rural taxpayer base who really has no dog in this fight. That will be hard for any Premier of whatever political stripe to counter. Anybody know where this project stands now.
|
|
Dugger
Blue-Chip Prospect
Posts: 442
|
2015-16
Jan 28, 2015 13:38:07 GMT -4
Post by Dugger on Jan 28, 2015 13:38:07 GMT -4
I would argue that there are other revenue generating potential investment to be made in the regions which would generate as much revenue for the government. One has only to think of the mine openings forecasted for the next 2-3 years which would create high paying jobs with a high tax rate and also royalties....we never got back in the Chaleur region the taxes paid by the miners along the last 49 years... The NB Government has been a milk cow for Moncton for quite a while already. I think the analogy you were looking for was one of Moncton being New Brunswick's Economic Engine, and for that you're welcome. Think of the Downtown Entertainment complex as payment for a job well done.
|
|
|
2015-16
Jan 28, 2015 13:59:42 GMT -4
Post by Captain Obvious on Jan 28, 2015 13:59:42 GMT -4
I would argue that there are other revenue generating potential investment to be made in the regions which would generate as much revenue for the government. One has only to think of the mine openings forecasted for the next 2-3 years which would create high paying jobs with a high tax rate and also royalties....we never got back in the Chaleur region the taxes paid by the miners along the last 49 years... The NB Government has been a milk cow for Moncton for quite a while already. The Chaleur region includes a lot of areas nearby that are seasonal, I'd say the government has put in a lot more than they have gotten from the mines. A huge percentage of the jobs within 90 minutes of Bathurst are seasonal. Those jobs don't usually carry their share of the tax revenue. The Moncton area if anything has been helping subsidize the north. If you can't see that you obviously have no clue on taxes and public finances.
|
|
|
2015-16
Jan 28, 2015 14:38:42 GMT -4
Post by npsh on Jan 28, 2015 14:38:42 GMT -4
I would argue that there are other revenue generating potential investment to be made in the regions which would generate as much revenue for the government. One has only to think of the mine openings forecasted for the next 2-3 years which would create high paying jobs with a high tax rate and also royalties....we never got back in the Chaleur region the taxes paid by the miners along the last 49 years... The NB Government has been a milk cow for Moncton for quite a while already. The Chaleur region includes a lot of areas nearby that are seasonal, I'd say the government has put in a lot more than they have gotten from the mines. A huge percentage of the jobs within 90 minutes of Bathurst are seasonal. Those jobs don't usually carry their share of the tax revenue. The Moncton area if anything has been helping subsidize the north. If you can't see that you obviously have no clue on taxes and public finances. I think you are missing a little point as well Captain, perhaps if I can be so bold as to enlighten. The essence of politics and politicians is “power,” getting and more important, retaining it. This provision (power) isn’t under the purview of Moncton alone others have a big input as well judging by the number of one term administrations this Province has seen over the past number of years. Voices who do not share what Moncton thinks is their “standing” for the common economic good, have and will be heard. This, I am sure you understand is known as ‘the vote”. Politics will no doubt be the factor on this proposed new centre.
|
|
|
2015-16
Jan 29, 2015 14:31:23 GMT -4
Post by chsb on Jan 29, 2015 14:31:23 GMT -4
I would argue that there are other revenue generating potential investment to be made in the regions which would generate as much revenue for the government. One has only to think of the mine openings forecasted for the next 2-3 years which would create high paying jobs with a high tax rate and also royalties....we never got back in the Chaleur region the taxes paid by the miners along the last 49 years... The NB Government has been a milk cow for Moncton for quite a while already. The Chaleur region includes a lot of areas nearby that are seasonal, I'd say the government has put in a lot more than they have gotten from the mines. A huge percentage of the jobs within 90 minutes of Bathurst are seasonal. Those jobs don't usually carry their share of the tax revenue. The Moncton area if anything has been helping subsidize the north. If you can't see that you obviously have no clue on taxes and public finances. For decades we had 4 pulp mills plus a smelter plus a 1000 miners' mine who were pumping money elsewhere provincially. If you cannot see this, you never witnessed the poor level of service we were getting in the North compared to the level of taxes we were pumping in the South coffers. Now you might have a case, but the condescendant way we are described here is simply untrue and unfactual.
|
|