Team Toughness or lack of it

[Score]

The Rocket lacked some toughness last season and had to go out and acquire Laffey from VD.

I agree with most that the "one dimensional goon" is not needed, however having a player that can drop the mitts and come out on top majority of the time is still needed.

As of now we have a couple players that will fight, but would rather them be on the ice then in the box.

Gervais
Paynter
Main

None of the players mentioned above are "big" kids, and are average middle weights at that. (Even though I've never seen Paynter lose many...if any)

We have a big kid coming to camp from Ont. Which I'm sure is to see if he can possibly fill this "role".
MacKenzie Koopmans
Birth Place: Barrie, ON
Date of Birth: 1988-03-26
Weight: 230 lbs
Height: 6' 4"
Position: Defenceman

Also we have Tanner Manson who is listed as 190 lbs and 6' 0".
Manson (16 yrs) is the younger brother of Triston Manson, a veteran Q tough guy.
If they feel that Tanner could fill this role, it wont be for a couple years yet IMO.

[habs24]

Yes it may be another tough(lack of??) start to the year for the Rockettes. Hopefully someone will come out of camp that will be able to handle the job. We don't want to have Morrison, Walker, or Doyle taking the abuse like Lali did the first half of last year. This Koopmans kid seems to have great size

[Krang7]

Koopmans has size, sure, but there is no room on our D corps for him. There's no way we take away a spot from Clow, Deighan, Malouin or whoever for someone to fight. Maybe move him to the fourth line but he won't be playing on D.

I'd say we'll be looking to add a true enforcer (or goon, if you prefer) like we did last year with Laferriere. Obviously the options are limited and it would be more ideal to develop someone in our system into that role (and Manson could be that but needs a couple of years) but I don't think there is much choice. There's no denying that Laffy was an important piece of our second half turnaround last season, even though he couldn't punch through a wet brown paper bag.

[North Shore]

The team needs a tough guy to stand up when opponents are taking cheap shots at the players. We do have a few guys with the heart to stand up but they don't have the size to take on some of the heavy weights and their time would be better spent on the ice than in the box.

Last season, after the team acquired Lafferriere they seemed to play with more confidence.

In an ideal world it would be great to have a tough guy with either solid offensive or defensive skills. There doesn't seem to be many of these guys available, maybe Koopmans will fill the bill. If not, the price of a fourth line development spot for a one dimensional tough guy is the cost of a key element to a competitive team.

[dogpound]

I fail to see the point of acquiring goons like Laferrière.

More goons = more stupid, boring, staged fights, since both the goon and management have to justify acquiring the goon.....otherwise they all look silly.

Same with whatsisname the year before - couldn't play, couldn't skate, had no idea what to do with the puck the few times he touched it.....useless.

Some fans find this entertaining - I just find it dumb in the extreme, and..........booooooring!

[Krang7]

I agree, staged fights are crap and I have no use for them.

But....

I'd like to remind you of a game last season against Halifax. Daniel Smith was taking liberties on Guilaume Doucet in front of the net, obviously knowing that Doucet wasn't going to fight him or anything like that, and he felt pretty safe doing it.

Jean immediately sends Laffy onto the ice and he confronts Smith, asking him to go, basically calling him out on trying to be a tough guy. Of course Smith was now in way over his head, I think you could see the distinct shade of brown on the back of his pants when he realized what Laffy was coming onto the ice for.

Needless to say Smith didn't take any more liberties on our smaller players for the rest of the game.

That's what makes these goon type players important (although in this case Paynter could have worked just as well, since Smith chickened out of fighting him too.)

I agree that it'd be nice if the guy actually had some talent to go along with that, but Jimmy Bonneau's don't come around every day unfortunately.

[Score]

krang7 said:

I'd like to remind you of a game last season against Halifax. Daniel Smith was taking liberties on Guilaume Doucet in front of the net, obviously knowing that Doucet wasn't going to fight him or anything like that, and he felt pretty safe doing it.

Jean immediately sends Laffy onto the ice and he confronts Smith, asking him to go, basically calling him out on trying to be a tough guy. Of course Smith was now in way over his head, I think you could see the distinct shade of brown on the back of his pants when he realized what Laffy was coming onto the ice for.

Needless to say Smith didn't take any more liberties on our smaller players for the rest of the game.

[dogpound]

krang7 said:

I agree, staged fights are crap and I have no use for them.

But....

I'd like to remind you of a game last season against Halifax. Daniel Smith was taking liberties on Guilaume Doucet in front of the net, obviously knowing that Doucet wasn't going to fight him or anything like that, and he felt pretty safe doing it.

Jean immediately sends Laffy onto the ice and he confronts Smith, asking him to go, basically calling him out on trying to be a tough guy. Of course Smith was now in way over his head, I think you could see the distinct shade of brown on the back of his pants when he realized what Laffy was coming onto the ice for.

Needless to say Smith didn't take any more liberties on our smaller players for the rest of the game.

That's what makes these goon type players important (although in this case Paynter could have worked just as well, since Smith chickened out of fighting him too.)

I agree that it'd be nice if the guy actually had some talent to go along with that, but Jimmy Bonneau's don't come around every day unfortunately.

I have no problem at all with players like Paynter, Bonneau, or other players who can combine hockey with toughness and the occasional fight.

I DO have problems with Laferrière and others of that type - the ones who CAN'T PLAY HOCKEY but are on the roster anyway, just to amuse the so-called fans who like this type of stupidity.

[Michael Phelps]

The league isn't near as 'tough guy-ish' as it used to be. This upcomming season, the 'Veteran' fighters who have been in the league all seem to be nothing more then good fiesty Middleweight scrappers (excluding Hennegan). You have Roch, Bouchard, Gallant x2, Graham, J.Roch, all within the projected top 10 for the league. All those guys in my eyes are just good experienced Middleweights.

Even with newcommers entering the league. Like the guy mentioned above at 230, unless he's faught in a league much similar to the QMJHL I imagine he'd only be able to duke it out with a Middleweight (for the first year).

Each year now you can see the league going back to skill more and more. But I'm a believer that there will be more fiesty middleweights this year then legit Heavy's like your Cormiers/Lizon/Doyle/Lafferier etc..etc..

[Stuck in a Loop...]

Man that guy is funny( the one yelling come on Chicken lol) he gets section 17 going all the time and the 3 blind mice thing he brings is Awesome, Hes not on here is he? If he is i must say keep it up dude lol

[juniorcormier16]

It will be a interesting year for fights.. There has been a lot so far in pre season with the Quebec teams. Fights are in the game weather you like it or u hate it.. wheres my buddy frank at anyways.. Its always going to be there Every team is going to need at least one guy that can hold his own and stand up for his teammates. Should be interesting with this guy from ont to see what he will do vs the foggie devils.. looking foward to it

[themagician]

This team needs one of the Gallant brothers and all of a sudden your toughness problem and a bit of your ticket sales problem will go away.

[Score]

themagician said:

This team needs one of the Gallant brothers and all of a sudden your toughness problem and a bit of your ticket sales problem will go away.

but can you actually give a 20yr old spot to Brad?

Brett would be nice here, but:
1)Would SJ let him go?
no

2) Does he want to play here?
dont think so

[juniorcormier16]

this big guy will be cut this mackenzie guy hes not really good on d and he never droped the mits once in this mornings game should be interesting tonight.

[markofthebeast]

Well you guys have the perfect test for toughness in your first 2 exp games Vs the Devs. Depending on who Real dresses, we will have anywhere from 4-5 guys who would be more then willing to drop the mitts. The fact that Real loves that type of hockey pleases me. Don't get me wrong I think a "fighter" should be able to at least play a good checking role and not be a detriment to the team (seems like a few of you are looking for maybe a little too much from a “goon”) but it's good to know if things start getting out of hand we have more then enough willing participants to handle it.

BTW did anyone happen to attend part of the Fogies training camp?