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Post by mullycat on Nov 13, 2014 15:46:10 GMT -4
Tired of reading about how team is being carried by four or five players. Barbashev,Garland,tkachev,Lalonde are a combined total points of 103. Their plus minus record is a combined +8. Guess it doesn't take Scotty Bowman to figure out that these players need to play better defensively as well as putting up numbers. Before two of these players were injured it was hard to understand why Rumble would carry a full team out of the dressing room. These four players would have their tongues hanging out before heading to the bench and then thrown right back out again. Which no doubt is a major contributer to their poor defensive game. To that the coach carries a lot of the responsibility. Since the injuries, for the most part the remainder of the club have been chipping in one way or another.Hard earned goals and playing solid roles, penalty killing etc. It's not fancy flash but the remainder of the team have had a chance to get some icetime and are proving that given a chance they can help this team play better. Their record of the last 7 or 8 games proves just that. When those players return from injury and if the coach implements a simple defensive system for all of them to follow, this could be a contender not a pretender hockey club. Assuming he doesn't go back to a 4 or 5 man club playing them until no juice left in the batteries.!! IMO
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Post by mooseinfo on Nov 13, 2014 21:55:37 GMT -4
Tired of reading about how team is being carried by four or five players. Barbashev,Garland,tkachev,Lalonde are a combined total points of 103. Their plus minus record is a combined +8. Guess it doesn't take Scotty Bowman to figure out that these players need to play better defensively as well as putting up numbers. Before two of these players were injured it was hard to understand why Rumble would carry a full team out of the dressing room. These four players would have their tongues hanging out before heading to the bench and then thrown right back out again. Which no doubt is a major contributer to their poor defensive game. To that the coach carries a lot of the responsibility. Since the injuries, for the most part the remainder of the club have been chipping in one way or another.Hard earned goals and playing solid roles, penalty killing etc. It's not fancy flash but the remainder of the team have had a chance to get some icetime and are proving that given a chance they can help this team play better. Their record of the last 7 or 8 games proves just that. When those players return from injury and if the coach implements a simple defensive system for all of them to follow, this could be a contender not a pretender hockey club. Assuming he doesn't go back to a 4 or 5 man club playing them until no juice left in the batteries.!! IMO Agree they should load up. They would then catch SJ as they likely just tinker during trade period and the other teams in the division are weak. That would give them 3rd seed and with the right match ups who knows as they may avoid Quebec until the finals. If they were to sell it could be 3 or 4 years for another chance comes along.
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Post by L'il Boy on Nov 14, 2014 7:24:25 GMT -4
Tired of reading about how team is being carried by four or five players. Barbashev,Garland,tkachev,Lalonde are a combined total points of 103. Their plus minus record is a combined +8. Guess it doesn't take Scotty Bowman to figure out that these players need to play better defensively as well as putting up numbers. Before two of these players were injured it was hard to understand why Rumble would carry a full team out of the dressing room. These four players would have their tongues hanging out before heading to the bench and then thrown right back out again. Which no doubt is a major contributer to their poor defensive game. To that the coach carries a lot of the responsibility. Since the injuries, for the most part the remainder of the club have been chipping in one way or another.Hard earned goals and playing solid roles, penalty killing etc. It's not fancy flash but the remainder of the team have had a chance to get some icetime and are proving that given a chance they can help this team play better. Their record of the last 7 or 8 games proves just that. When those players return from injury and if the coach implements a simple defensive system for all of them to follow, this could be a contender not a pretender hockey club. Assuming he doesn't go back to a 4 or 5 man club playing them until no juice left in the batteries.!! IMO Garland's tongue should never be hanging out.....he spends most of his shifts lollygagging in the neutral zone, watching the rest of his teammates play defence.
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Dugger
Blue-Chip Prospect
Posts: 442
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Post by Dugger on Nov 14, 2014 9:09:25 GMT -4
Tired of reading about how team is being carried by four or five players. Barbashev,Garland,tkachev,Lalonde are a combined total points of 103. Their plus minus record is a combined +8. Guess it doesn't take Scotty Bowman to figure out that these players need to play better defensively as well as putting up numbers. Before two of these players were injured it was hard to understand why Rumble would carry a full team out of the dressing room. These four players would have their tongues hanging out before heading to the bench and then thrown right back out again. Which no doubt is a major contributer to their poor defensive game. To that the coach carries a lot of the responsibility. Since the injuries, for the most part the remainder of the club have been chipping in one way or another.Hard earned goals and playing solid roles, penalty killing etc. It's not fancy flash but the remainder of the team have had a chance to get some icetime and are proving that given a chance they can help this team play better. Their record of the last 7 or 8 games proves just that. When those players return from injury and if the coach implements a simple defensive system for all of them to follow, this could be a contender not a pretender hockey club. Assuming he doesn't go back to a 4 or 5 man club playing them until no juice left in the batteries.!! IMO Agree they should load up. They would then catch SJ as they likely just tinker during trade period and the other teams in the division are weak. That would give them 3rd seed and with the right match ups who knows as they may avoid Quebec until the finals. If they were to sell it could be 3 or 4 years for another chance comes along. This team is not as good as the team two years ago and we saw how that turned out. This club is entertaining on most nights but they are not a contender and have nothing in the cupboards to use as assets to fill the holes needed to be filled to be even considered a mediocre contender. If we can, we should sell what assets we do have but the fact is our assets consist of mainly Europeans and two 20 year olds, none of which are moved easily. If we can't get anything substantial for these players than we keep the status quot and hope for the best. We can't drain our cupboards anymore than we already have (this would account for the more than usual number of American players) to bolster a middle of the pack, defensively vulnerable hockey team. Irving is desperate for a championship and is chasing a solution, that needs to change.
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Post by Captain Obvious on Nov 14, 2014 9:13:45 GMT -4
Agree they should load up. They would then catch SJ as they likely just tinker during trade period and the other teams in the division are weak. That would give them 3rd seed and with the right match ups who knows as they may avoid Quebec until the finals. If they were to sell it could be 3 or 4 years for another chance comes along. This team is not as good as the team two years ago and we saw how that turned out. This club is entertaining on most nights but they are not a contender and have nothing in the cupboards to use as assets to fill the holes needed to be filled to be even considered a mediocre contender. If we can, we should sell what assets we do have but the fact is our assets consist of mainly Europeans and two 20 year olds, none of which are moved easily. If we can't get anything substantial for these players than we keep the status quot and hope for the best. We can't drain our cupboards anymore than we already have (this would account for the more than usual number of American players) to bolster a middle of the pack, defensively vulnerable hockey team. Irving is desperate for a championship and is chasing a solution, that needs to change. Agree, I don't think contending is a realistic option given that the cupboards are not very stocked. If you add the 3-4 big pieces missing, you have nothing left in terms of blue chip assets going forward. Imagine how the cupboards would have looked had they solid in 2013 and not gone after Danault.
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Post by SteveUL on Nov 14, 2014 10:27:47 GMT -4
This team is not as good as the team two years ago and we saw how that turned out. This club is entertaining on most nights but they are not a contender and have nothing in the cupboards to use as assets to fill the holes needed to be filled to be even considered a mediocre contender. If we can, we should sell what assets we do have but the fact is our assets consist of mainly Europeans and two 20 year olds, none of which are moved easily. If we can't get anything substantial for these players than we keep the status quot and hope for the best. We can't drain our cupboards anymore than we already have (this would account for the more than usual number of American players) to bolster a middle of the pack, defensively vulnerable hockey team. Irving is desperate for a championship and is chasing a solution, that needs to change. Agree, I don't think contending is a realistic option given that the cupboards are not very stocked. If you add the 3-4 big pieces missing, you have nothing left in terms of blue chip assets going forward. Imagine how the cupboards would have looked had they solid in 2013 and not gone after Danault. I think this team could get to the Prez Cup final if the stars align properly. We have to stay healthy ... have to take our division ... probably need 2nd seed overall at worst ... and we'd need to add a top 6 forward and top 2 Dman. This won't win a Memorial Cup ... but it might get you there (back door) ... and might pull an upset in the Prez Cup final. Lets assume Rimouski gets 1st overall. If we can take our division (won't be easy) then we'd (in theory) face the division winner of the West ... in Rd 3. This league has no clear cut runaway winners this year .... like Halifax and SJ of previous seasons. Winning this year or at least getting to the final is not out of reach. Xmas moves by everybody will tell the story.
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Post by Captain Obvious on Nov 14, 2014 11:08:41 GMT -4
Agree, I don't think contending is a realistic option given that the cupboards are not very stocked. If you add the 3-4 big pieces missing, you have nothing left in terms of blue chip assets going forward. Imagine how the cupboards would have looked had they solid in 2013 and not gone after Danault. I think this team could get to the Prez Cup final if the stars align properly. We have to stay healthy ... have to take our division ... probably need 2nd seed overall at worst ... and we'd need to add a top 6 forward and top 2 Dman. This won't win a Memorial Cup ... but it might get you there (back door) ... and might pull an upset in the Prez Cup final. Lets assume Rimouski gets 1st overall. If we can take our division (won't be easy) then we'd (in theory) face the division winner of the West ... in Rd 3. This league has no clear cut runaway winners this year .... like Halifax and SJ of previous seasons. Winning this year or at least getting to the final is not out of reach. Xmas moves by everybody will tell the story. The problem with that is that you deplete an already weak cupboard(top 2 d-men and top 6 forwards non Euro or 20) won't come cheap. Those two big pieces alone will cost the 3-4 best assets available...2015 1st, 2016 1st, Leger plus probably Sweeney at the draft. It still leaves you with a team that could lose in round 1 or round 2 and give you another 3-4 year rebuild.
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Post by mooseinfo on Nov 14, 2014 11:39:12 GMT -4
I think this team could get to the Prez Cup final if the stars align properly. We have to stay healthy ... have to take our division ... probably need 2nd seed overall at worst ... and we'd need to add a top 6 forward and top 2 Dman. This won't win a Memorial Cup ... but it might get you there (back door) ... and might pull an upset in the Prez Cup final. Lets assume Rimouski gets 1st overall. If we can take our division (won't be easy) then we'd (in theory) face the division winner of the West ... in Rd 3. This league has no clear cut runaway winners this year .... like Halifax and SJ of previous seasons. Winning this year or at least getting to the final is not out of reach. Xmas moves by everybody will tell the story. The problem with that is that you deplete an already weak cupboard(top 2 d-men and top 6 forwards non Euro or 20) won't come cheap. Those two big pieces alone will cost the 3-4 best assets available...2015 1st, 2016 1st, Leger plus probably Sweeney at the draft. It still leaves you with a team that could lose in round 1 or round 2 and give you another 3-4 year rebuild. You have to consider how this team uses its picks (dont need high picks for Americans) and even teams that sell take 3-4 years to rebuild.
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Post by lirette on Nov 14, 2014 11:49:06 GMT -4
I think this team could get to the Prez Cup final if the stars align properly. We have to stay healthy ... have to take our division ... probably need 2nd seed overall at worst ... and we'd need to add a top 6 forward and top 2 Dman. This won't win a Memorial Cup ... but it might get you there (back door) ... and might pull an upset in the Prez Cup final. Lets assume Rimouski gets 1st overall. If we can take our division (won't be easy) then we'd (in theory) face the division winner of the West ... in Rd 3. This league has no clear cut runaway winners this year .... like Halifax and SJ of previous seasons. Winning this year or at least getting to the final is not out of reach. Xmas moves by everybody will tell the story. The problem with that is that you deplete an already weak cupboard(top 2 d-men and top 6 forwards non Euro or 20) won't come cheap. Those two big pieces alone will cost the 3-4 best assets available...2015 1st, 2016 1st, Leger plus probably Sweeney at the draft. It still leaves you with a team that could lose in round 1 or round 2 and give you another 3-4 year rebuild. Its a strange situation this year because looking across the league I am having trouble even identifying who are the clear sellers, and of those sellers there doesn't seem to be much to trade for in terms of 19 year old top 6 forwards or top 2 dmen. here's what I see available from the potential sellers keeping in mind Bathurst (will they even sell?) D to sell - Gosselin, Gingras , Tricket, Dumulong F to sell - Simpson (cant trade for him) Halifax D to sell - Murphy F to sell Falkenham? (probably returning as a 20 and captain) Drummondville Don't see anything of interest there for 19's Val Dor - F to sell - Beauregard (Richard/aube kubel/Gauthier are 18 but would love to have either) D to sell - Fraser? (would have to trade tassi) Rouyn D- Guenette All of their other top assets are 18 (id love to grab Francis Perron but at what cost?) Do any of these players I've listed above cost the top assets you've mentioned other than maybe Murphy (whos struggling) ? Hard to say what else is out there but the top assets on most of the weaker teams are 18. IT appears that it could be a sellers market but at the same time if these teams don't have anything of value to sell then not really.
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Post by bois on Nov 14, 2014 12:22:12 GMT -4
Yep nobody seems to be mentioning the complete lack of impact 19 year olds in the league this year...... i think those expecting teams to do the big buy or sell in the traditional sense will be disappointed by the trade period
more likely a bunch of depth players moved... and some 18's
similar to last years trade period where teams perhaps are buying for now... but really moreso for next year
and yeah you guys don't need your firsts... you just pick Americans with whatever picks you have and then toss some Irving cash at them to come... you don't rebuild
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Post by SteveUL on Nov 14, 2014 12:49:29 GMT -4
I think this team could get to the Prez Cup final if the stars align properly. We have to stay healthy ... have to take our division ... probably need 2nd seed overall at worst ... and we'd need to add a top 6 forward and top 2 Dman. This won't win a Memorial Cup ... but it might get you there (back door) ... and might pull an upset in the Prez Cup final. Lets assume Rimouski gets 1st overall. If we can take our division (won't be easy) then we'd (in theory) face the division winner of the West ... in Rd 3. This league has no clear cut runaway winners this year .... like Halifax and SJ of previous seasons. Winning this year or at least getting to the final is not out of reach. Xmas moves by everybody will tell the story. The problem with that is that you deplete an already weak cupboard(top 2 d-men and top 6 forwards non Euro or 20) won't come cheap. Those two big pieces alone will cost the 3-4 best assets available...2015 1st, 2016 1st, Leger plus probably Sweeney at the draft. It still leaves you with a team that could lose in round 1 or round 2 and give you another 3-4 year rebuild. Yup ... you've been saying that for 5 years ... but here we are again looking at contending. Shit can happen in the playoffs ... but you can't step back because you are afraid to fail. That is a pessimistic attitude that will get you an annual mid-pack ranking ... an attitude that you seem to love to go through life with. I don't think this team is anywhere as good as our championship teams of the past ... but neither is anybody else in the Q right now ... not a big year for the Q. The top teams are all beatable ... right now. And let me get this straight ... to avoid another 3 or 4 year rebuild ... you want us to step back and sell ... making this current rebuild a 3 or 4 year process. Is that what you are suggesting ... avoid a 3-4 year rebuild by rebuilding for 3-4 years.
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Post by catnut on Nov 14, 2014 12:50:34 GMT -4
Yep nobody seems to be mentioning the complete lack of impact 19 year olds in the league this year...... i think those expecting teams to do the big buy or sell in the traditional sense will be disappointed by the trade period more likely a bunch of depth players moved... and some 18's similar to last years trade period where teams perhaps are buying for now... but really moreso for next year and yeah you guys don't need your firsts... you just pick Americans with whatever picks you have and then toss some Irving cash at them to come... you don't rebuild There are impact 19 YO but most of them are on the top teams and unlikely to be moved (probably why they are the top teams).
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Post by mooseinfo on Nov 14, 2014 13:03:47 GMT -4
A lot could depend on the Sags. Not saying their 19s are impact but they have the experience which often inflates price, see Penny last year. But they beat BC last night easy without need for good goaltending. With the way teams are all over the place they have lots of futures to stay in the conversation, if they want.
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Post by bois on Nov 14, 2014 14:18:40 GMT -4
Yep nobody seems to be mentioning the complete lack of impact 19 year olds in the league this year...... i think those expecting teams to do the big buy or sell in the traditional sense will be disappointed by the trade period more likely a bunch of depth players moved... and some 18's similar to last years trade period where teams perhaps are buying for now... but really moreso for next year and yeah you guys don't need your firsts... you just pick Americans with whatever picks you have and then toss some Irving cash at them to come... you don't rebuild There are impact 19 YO but most of them are on the top teams and unlikely to be moved (probably why they are the top teams). not nearly as many as in years past...
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Post by forrest on Nov 14, 2014 14:42:39 GMT -4
Give these guys a better collective team system and make the players more accountable for their effort and you have a different team. I'm not saying they should be scared of making mistakes, or shouldn't be creative, but right now, the balance has tipped on the other side and there are way too many individual efforts. And the forwards are often out of position when they don't have the puck.
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