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Post by Citris on Jan 17, 2018 23:33:01 GMT -4
I'm not sure he is being challenged where he is now ... he seems to be able to score at will in the NSMML. If you could get him onto a Jr A team that might be the best option ... but it wouldn't hurt him to be here and building muscle and getting use to the speed of the game. But you have to play him here ... can't play him like they played Bellamy. I'm not a fan of any prospect playing Major Midget at 17 ... and this guy clearly doesn't belong there. He was taken 1st overall in the 2017 MHL draft by South Shore, but chose not to report. I don't think there's necessarily anything wrong with him playing Major Midget this year, or finishing the year, and I also disagree that there's nothing for him to prove. He's got big shoes to fill from last year, he was part of the first ever Atlantic Telus Cup Champions, but now he's gone from a secondary guy to the guy. I know that room really wants to get back to the Telus Cup, and although you may not get tough games every night in Major Midget, those games against Halifax or Dartmouth aren't easy, and if they make it to the Atlantics, those games aren't easy either. I personally think he made a very good choice to not join a strong South Shore Lumberjacks team where he'd see limited ice, and instead stay put in Major Midget, where he's a top guy who put himself on the Q radar like Hudson and Blackmoore did before him. |
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Post by downthemiddle on Jan 17, 2018 23:49:57 GMT -4
There's also something to be said for a winning program. What West did last year was improbable and they seem to have some of that magic left this year, can see why players are getting swept up in it.
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Post by scotiahockey on Jan 18, 2018 0:15:08 GMT -4
I'm not sure he is being challenged where he is now ... he seems to be able to score at will in the NSMML. If you could get him onto a Jr A team that might be the best option ... but it wouldn't hurt him to be here and building muscle and getting use to the speed of the game. But you have to play him here ... can't play him like they played Bellamy. I'm not a fan of any prospect playing Major Midget at 17 ... and this guy clearly doesn't belong there. He was taken 1st overall in the 2017 MHL draft by South Shore, but chose not to report. I don't think there's necessarily anything wrong with him playing Major Midget this year, or finishing the year, and I also disagree that there's nothing for him to prove. He's got big shoes to fill from last year, he was part of the first ever Atlantic Telus Cup Champions, but now he's gone from a secondary guy to the guy. I know that room really wants to get back to the Telus Cup, and although you may not get tough games every night in Major Midget, those games against Halifax or Dartmouth aren't easy, and if they make it to the Atlantics, those games aren't easy either. I personally think he made a very good choice to not join a strong South Shore Lumberjacks team where he'd see limited ice, and instead stay put in Major Midget, where he's a top guy who put himself on the Q radar like Hudson and Blackmoore did before him. There’s many guys every year that make the jump to Jr. A that don’t get the minutes they truly need to develop... if they stay in Major Midget they’ll get to play in more situations and become better all around players. They get a chance to finally be the guy. While there’s nothing wrong with the jump to Jr. A it’s not definitely not a prime spot for a guy to go if he wants to develop more.. unless you’re something else. I’d agree that Fox made the right decision, he got the chance to be the guy and put himself on the map. There’s a lot of guys that probably could do the same thing if they chose to stay in Midget at 16/17 but instead they go for the jump to Jr. A. Rarely if ever does it work out for a guy that’s looking to make the next level. Valley wanted Hudson to play for them last year, instead he went back to Midget and became so much better of a player. I can’t say for certain it develops his game better than if he played Jr. A but I know the Jr. A teams aren’t as concerned with developing a 16 year old kid for the Q as much as they are winning. On a completely unrelated note, I know they’re not the strongest team and it really hurt them losing Burns for the rest of the season but how did you think Whynot looked for Valley at the Ice Jam? Always been a big fan of his game and he’s looked poised in the games I’ve seen of him. |
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Post by Captain Obvious on Jan 18, 2018 9:32:36 GMT -4
I'm not sure he is being challenged where he is now ... he seems to be able to score at will in the NSMML. If you could get him onto a Jr A team that might be the best option ... but it wouldn't hurt him to be here and building muscle and getting use to the speed of the game. But you have to play him here ... can't play him like they played Bellamy. I'm not a fan of any prospect playing Major Midget at 17 ... and this guy clearly doesn't belong there. He was taken 1st overall in the 2017 MHL draft by South Shore, but chose not to report. I don't think there's necessarily anything wrong with him playing Major Midget this year, or finishing the year, and I also disagree that there's nothing for him to prove. He's got big shoes to fill from last year, he was part of the first ever Atlantic Telus Cup Champions, but now he's gone from a secondary guy to the guy. I know that room really wants to get back to the Telus Cup, and although you may not get tough games every night in Major Midget, those games against Halifax or Dartmouth aren't easy, and if they make it to the Atlantics, those games aren't easy either. I personally think he made a very good choice to not join a strong South Shore Lumberjacks team where he'd see limited ice, and instead stay put in Major Midget, where he's a top guy who put himself on the Q radar like Hudson and Blackmoore did before him. Jumping from MAAA at 17 to Q at 18 is not an easy jump to make...Jr.A would be a better step... |
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Post by jimmy on Jan 18, 2018 9:43:17 GMT -4
He was taken 1st overall in the 2017 MHL draft by South Shore, but chose not to report. I don't think there's necessarily anything wrong with him playing Major Midget this year, or finishing the year, and I also disagree that there's nothing for him to prove. He's got big shoes to fill from last year, he was part of the first ever Atlantic Telus Cup Champions, but now he's gone from a secondary guy to the guy. I know that room really wants to get back to the Telus Cup, and although you may not get tough games every night in Major Midget, those games against Halifax or Dartmouth aren't easy, and if they make it to the Atlantics, those games aren't easy either. I personally think he made a very good choice to not join a strong South Shore Lumberjacks team where he'd see limited ice, and instead stay put in Major Midget, where he's a top guy who put himself on the Q radar like Hudson and Blackmoore did before him. Jumping from MAAA at 17 to Q at 18 is not an easy jump to make...Jr.A would be a better step... While junior A at 18 is a logical development step, the challenge then becomes breaking into major junior as a 19 year old rookie. Playing midget at 17, no matter how well you do, pretty much forces the player to make a big step in their development in a subsequent year if they are going to catch up to their peer group and develop into a solid major junior player - either by jumping to the Q and becoming a regular at 18, or by breaking in as a 19 y/o rookie and pretty much immediately playing like a veteran.I think that is why you have to take most 17 year old midget performances with a grain of salt - once in a while it is a late bloomer who becomes a future Q star, but the majority top out as tweeners who become depth guys or junior A stars ... |
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Post by Captain Obvious on Jan 18, 2018 9:53:08 GMT -4
Jumping from MAAA at 17 to Q at 18 is not an easy jump to make...Jr.A would be a better step... While junior A at 18 is a logical development step, the challenge then becomes breaking into major junior as a 19 year old rookie. Playing midget at 17, no matter how well you do, pretty much forces the player to make a big step in their development in a subsequent year if they are going to catch up to their peer group and develop into a solid major junior player - either by jumping to the Q and becoming a regular at 18, or by breaking in as a 19 y/o rookie and pretty much immediately playing like a veteran.I think that is why you have to take most 17 year old midget performances with a grain of salt - once in a while it is a late bloomer who becomes a future Q star, but the majority top out as tweeners who become depth guys or junior A stars ... If a kid is a dominant MAAA caliber player at 17, that guy should have no issue playing Jr.A and getting top 9 minutes, if not top 6 minutes. Usually Jr.A teams give those kids guarantees if they are top guys and they want to keep them from going back to MAAA. |
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Post by Citris on Jan 18, 2018 14:47:44 GMT -4
There's a whole slew of stuff we could get into about Jr. A vs. Major Midget for development. Clearly thus far the Major Midget path has worked well for Fox.
Jr. A in a perfect world would be a developmental league, and in a perfect world the MHL would be a developmental league, but in its current state it's far from it. It's a league where 9 20 year olds are allowed on a roster, and where young players often leave in order to get more ice time elsewhere. I wouldn't say Fox would be guarenteed anything at the Jr. A level. He may join the Lumberjacks for the playoffs but that's about it.
This may be getting slightly off-topic, but, there seems to be 2 schools of thought within the MHL in terms of the direction it should be going.
The current paradigm seems to be to dress older teams that are competitive on a national level, and that development is a distant second to winning year by year.
But I've spoken to people including an MHL team president who would like to see the league shift toward a developmental league, Limit the ammount of 20's to between 1-3 and lower the draft age one year to 15. But they would have to be okay with being a developmental league and potentially losing their best players to Major Jr... unfortunately that probably won't happen any time soon, but it's an interesting thought.
Right now, Major Midget are the highest level developmental leagues we have, which I think hinders the development of players in the maritimes
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Post by Captain Obvious on Jan 18, 2018 14:51:01 GMT -4
There's a whole slew of stuff we could get into about Jr. A vs. Major Midget for development. Clearly thus far the Major Midget path has worked well for Fox. Jr. A in a perfect world would be a developmental league, and in a perfect world the MHL would be a developmental league, but in its current state it's far from it. It's a league where 9 20 year olds are allowed on a roster, and where young players often leave in order to get more ice time elsewhere. I wouldn't say Fox would be guarenteed anything at the Jr. A level. He may join the Lumberjacks for the playoffs but that's about it. This may be getting slightly off-topic, but, there seems to be 2 schools of thought within the MHL in terms of the direction it should be going. The current paradigm seems to be to dress older teams that are competitive on a national level, and that development is a distant second to winning year by year. But I've spoken to people including an MHL team president who would like to see the league shift toward a developmental league, Limit the ammount of 20's to between 1-3 and lower the draft age one year to 15. But they would have to be okay with being a developmental league and potentially losing their best players to Major Jr... unfortunately that probably won't happen any time soon, but it's an interesting thought. Right now, Major Midget are the highest level developmental leagues we have, which I think hinders the development of players in the maritimes I can only speak to the teams Dieppe had a few other local teams, they always seemed to have good 16/17 year olds playing regularly. A couple years back Dieppe had Lavoie and Cyr both at 16, Cyr was a top 10 scorer this year before getting hurt in the Q. |
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Post by Citris on Jan 18, 2018 15:03:06 GMT -4
I can only speak to the teams Dieppe had a few other local teams, they always seemed to have good 16/17 year olds playing regularly. A couple years back Dieppe had Lavoie and Cyr both at 16, Cyr was a top 10 scorer this year before getting hurt in the Q. That's fair, but I think there were a few things working in his favor there, He's a top talent, he'll perform at 16 in a way that a lot of guys wouldn't and it was close to home for him. There's no one-size fits all solution to development, and I think Fox's current path is just fine. |
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Post by SteveUL on Jan 19, 2018 8:45:13 GMT -4
There's a whole slew of stuff we could get into about Jr. A vs. Major Midget for development. Clearly thus far the Major Midget path has worked well for Fox. Jr. A in a perfect world would be a developmental league, and in a perfect world the MHL would be a developmental league, but in its current state it's far from it. It's a league where 9 20 year olds are allowed on a roster, and where young players often leave in order to get more ice time elsewhere. I wouldn't say Fox would be guarenteed anything at the Jr. A level. He may join the Lumberjacks for the playoffs but that's about it. This may be getting slightly off-topic, but, there seems to be 2 schools of thought within the MHL in terms of the direction it should be going. The current paradigm seems to be to dress older teams that are competitive on a national level, and that development is a distant second to winning year by year. But I've spoken to people including an MHL team president who would like to see the league shift toward a developmental league, Limit the ammount of 20's to between 1-3 and lower the draft age one year to 15. But they would have to be okay with being a developmental league and potentially losing their best players to Major Jr... unfortunately that probably won't happen any time soon, but it's an interesting thought. Right now, Major Midget are the highest level developmental leagues we have, which I think hinders the development of players in the maritimes I can only speak to the teams Dieppe had a few other local teams, they always seemed to have good 16/17 year olds playing regularly. A couple years back Dieppe had Lavoie and Cyr both at 16, Cyr was a top 10 scorer this year before getting hurt in the Q. But could Dieppe ever afford to have a full complement of 20 YO ? |
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Post by Captain Obvious on Jan 19, 2018 9:05:10 GMT -4
I can only speak to the teams Dieppe had a few other local teams, they always seemed to have good 16/17 year olds playing regularly. A couple years back Dieppe had Lavoie and Cyr both at 16, Cyr was a top 10 scorer this year before getting hurt in the Q. But could Dieppe ever afford to have a full complement of 20 YO ? They had 7 or 8 most years. |
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Post by islandred on Jan 19, 2018 11:45:10 GMT -4
The major midget vs. MHL debate is very interesting, that’s for sure. It entirely depends on the player, as we’ve seen success and failures with both routes.
For all the Mika Cyr’s, Zack MacEwen’s, and Drake Batherson’s that come out of the MHL, there’s also guys who didn’t develop as Q prospects as expected like Josh Pugsley, Riley Scott, and Tanner McCabe.
But you can also look at the MHL as a developmental route of it’s own, as when you look at a guy like Mccabe, who was seen as a bust at 17, now playing top 2/3 minutes at the AUS level, while when looking at a guy like Zach Moody who played 4 years in the Q, is now playing in a level 3 France pro league (only 4 GP).
Everyone develops at their own rate, and at the end of the day there is not a clearcut path right now.
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Post by scotiahockey on Jan 19, 2018 18:29:22 GMT -4
The major midget vs. MHL debate is very interesting, that’s for sure. It entirely depends on the player, as we’ve seen success and failures with both routes. For all the Mika Cyr’s, Zack MacEwen’s, and Drake Batherson’s that come out of the MHL, there’s also guys who didn’t develop as Q prospects as expected like Josh Pugsley, Riley Scott, and Tanner McCabe. But you can also look at the MHL as a developmental route of it’s own, as when you look at a guy like Mccabe, who was seen as a bust at 17, now playing top 2/3 minutes at the AUS level, while when looking at a guy like Zach Moody who played 4 years in the Q, is now playing in a level 3 France pro league (only 4 GP). Everyone develops at their own rate, and at the end of the day there is not a clearcut path right now. Moody is out of hockey now but I think he could have played at the same level regardless. The MHL is a great development league to push guys through to the CIS level, there’s no disputing that but for 16 year old kids, the success rate isn’t really high for them as far as moving onto the Q and having extended success at that level. Every situation is different and the MHL will work for some guys but if I have a 16 year old that I think is a highly regarded prospect, I’d have a tough time sending him to the MHL. It just doesn’t have a history of working out well for them. |
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