|
Post by blueeagle on Dec 23, 2022 12:28:24 GMT -4
Great discussion with some very good points on all sides. I think one mistake that is being made here is looking at players purely in terms of age and position. Saying we should have kept Squires instead of Biggar makes no sense to me. They may be the same age and position, but thats where similarities end. Biggar is a vastly superior player.
To be clear, I think Biggar was slightly expensive. But I don't really have a problem with it. We have 10 picks in the first two rounds of the next 2 drafts. I don't think moving one for 1.5 years of a top pair D-man is the end of the world. You also have to look at his future value - would people be more ok with this move if he has a good 12 months and we recoup the cost next winter?
Another thing that I don't know is being given enough thought is the effect that having a solid veteran that can play many minutes has on the development of our younger guys. I don't understand why anyone would be suggesting we should have gone and got a 17 year old instead. That is not a need that we have to fill. We already have three D that are 17 or under, and two are legit top prospects. Down the road we will buy '05s/'06s. But if we bring in more now, and make it 4 or 5 of them in the lineup every night, do we really think that won't have a negative effect on their development? You need vets. It isn't a video game. There are personal dynamics at play here too.
I am not saying I think Sly has nailed it so far. I'm simply saying it is way to early to say one way or the other. But I really think we are able to acquire Biggar without negatively effecting our ability to build this team through the draft. It improves our team for 1.5 years, and that is worth something. We have to be a winning team next year. You don't go from 3 years in the basement to suddenly being a contender. Next year is a big year for this team.
Also, forget the playoff comment. This move had absolutely nothing to do with making the playoffs this year. As I said, this roster could get worse at the deadline and should still make the playoffs. It's a meaningless comment. This move is about having the right balance of experience and development.
|
|
|
Post by blueeagle on Dec 23, 2022 12:35:14 GMT -4
Re: Desruissault my only issue with the speculation is that I don't want to see players effected by an out of control rumor mill either. Is it a case of where there is smoke there is fire re: the french board post? Has anyone hear heard anything? Or are we speculating? Because if its only speculation....its rough to see that on a 16yr old unless there's more to it. That's all i'm saying...or asking I guess. Its just a bit deflating to see that as the talk vs some others. Re: the trades...The Buteau move was good. The Biggar deal was bad. Only if viewed through the lense of asset management by a bad team. Sold an 18 for 2 2nds and a 5th. Bought a 19 for a 2nd and a 3rd. Basically the net gain of moving up a round and gaining a 5th but sacrificing a year of service to do it. If viewed through the lense of winning hockey games between now and June its not as bad. But shouldn't we question buying vets at the cost as if we're buyers vs finding a vet of 2 across the league who can still eat minutes but not cost quite as much? Honest question: Do you think the overall trades Sly has made has moved the Eagles closer to changing the culture and contending or simply furthering the image that players don't want to be here and our management has a plan they're executing? I'm not seeing it. But i'm curious how others are viewing it.JB to answer that question - I don't really think that's a great way of framing it. Trades alone are not what is going to fix the culture of this team. The culture issue isn't down to the players. We've had the same issue for many, many years. The issue predates any individual player that is currently on the roster. The culture change can only come when the organization addresses its actual larger issues. A clueless president. A carousel of coaches. Part-time GMs. Small-market attitude. Pie-in-the-sky drafting. These are the culture issues, and shipping out Buteau and bringing in Biggar will do nothing to change them. But, if we were to look at one element of Sly's tenure so far that does make me slightly optimistic that it may be changing, I'd look at our draft. We went after 3 of the better prospects in the draft, and moved decisively to get them. Shields was talked about as a potential NCAA player, but we sold him on CB. We've heard how our '06s have been working on Cloutier at Canada camps. While none of this means anything yet, it certainly is an unfamiliar narrative for Eagles fans.
|
|
|
Post by gocapebreton on Dec 23, 2022 13:48:19 GMT -4
Great discussion with some very good points on all sides. I think one mistake that is being made here is looking at players purely in terms of age and position. Saying we should have kept Squires instead of Biggar makes no sense to me. They may be the same age and position, but thats where similarities end. Biggar is a vastly superior player. To be clear, I think Biggar was slightly expensive. But I don't really have a problem with it. We have 10 picks in the first two rounds of the next 2 drafts. I don't think moving one for 1.5 years of a top pair D-man is the end of the world. You also have to look at his future value - would people be more ok with this move if he has a good 12 months and we recoup the cost next winter? Another thing that I don't know is being given enough thought is the effect that having a solid veteran that can play many minutes has on the development of our younger guys. I don't understand why anyone would be suggesting we should have gone and got a 17 year old instead. That is not a need that we have to fill. We already have three D that are 17 or under, and two are legit top prospects. Down the road we will buy '05s/'06s. But if we bring in more now, and make it 4 or 5 of them in the lineup every night, do we really think that won't have a negative effect on their development? You need vets. It isn't a video game. There are personal dynamics at play here too. I am not saying I think Sly has nailed it so far. I'm simply saying it is way to early to say one way or the other. But I really think we are able to acquire Biggar without negatively effecting our ability to build this team through the draft. It improves our team for 1.5 years, and that is worth something. We have to be a winning team next year. You don't go from 3 years in the basement to suddenly being a contender. Next year is a big year for this team. Also, forget the playoff comment. This move had absolutely nothing to do with making the playoffs this year. As I said, this roster could get worse at the deadline and should still make the playoffs. It's a meaningless comment. This move is about having the right balance of experience and development. [br Yes, the team simply cannot trade off their best D and replace him with a bottom pairing D. Regardless of where they are in the standings, they cannot afford to further burden their existing D and more so Ruccia. This kid is facing 35 or more shots every game as it is now. He is a far better goalie than his record shows. The end result is confidence issues. If this kid were on better team where he faced under 30 shots a game, I think his confidence and save %, etc. go up to around .91 or so. This conference , outside of Quebec and Halifax is rather weak and considering Charlottetown and AB are unloading, 6th place in the conference is attainable. That gives them a fair chance at winning a round, and frankly from a business point at this stage, that is huge. This all said, I would have possibly gone an alternate route and bid high on Jordan Tourigny, if there was any chance of getting him. If you trade Langlois and for arguments sake bring back a Hinkley plus a 1st, then try and unload that 1st plus another 1st and the mid 2nd and 3rd you spent on Biggar. That would more solidify the D for a projected 24/25 run. Either way you’re replacing Langlois with a top 4 D.
|
|
|
Post by Citris on Dec 23, 2022 15:34:51 GMT -4
Not sure if it's been posted elsewhere, but the Eagles acquire 17 year old Jude Campbell from Rimouski in exchange for a 3rd in 2025
|
|
|
Post by Score on Dec 23, 2022 15:39:51 GMT -4
Not sure if it's been posted elsewhere, but the Eagles acquire 17 year old Jude Campbell from Rimouski in exchange for a 3rd in 2025 Good Charlottetown boy....🙂🙂
|
|
|
Post by Score on Dec 23, 2022 15:46:19 GMT -4
How about trading the Squires kid back home to reunite with his Big Bro.....
Cam Squires
For
Brett Arsenault Will Allen 3rd
🤣🤣
|
|
|
Post by Pirate on Dec 23, 2022 16:18:24 GMT -4
|
|
|
Post by Charles on Dec 23, 2022 16:19:01 GMT -4
Derussieaux and a 1st to Chicoutimi for Jacob Newcombe a 1st and 2nd !!!
|
|
|
Post by Captain Obvious on Dec 23, 2022 16:31:24 GMT -4
Am I the only one confused as to what Couturier is doing?
|
|
|
Post by hal on Dec 23, 2022 16:47:26 GMT -4
I guess the Kid did want out . Didn't they trade a 1st to move up to get Deserreuix ?
|
|
|
Post by hal on Dec 23, 2022 16:48:33 GMT -4
Anybody got any info on Campbell or Newcombe ?
|
|
|
Post by Jack Bauer on Dec 23, 2022 17:06:05 GMT -4
I guess the Kid did want out . Didn't they trade a 1st to move up to get Deserreuix ? No. He was basically used with the pick they got from Bathurst in the Perron trade. They traded down from that pick but used the 2023 1st as a placeholder.
|
|
|
Post by Jack Bauer on Dec 23, 2022 17:07:17 GMT -4
Whats the logic of moving the pick trades here? Pointless to even comment on another player wanting out. So who really benefits from the 1sts that move?
|
|
|
Post by blueeagle on Dec 23, 2022 17:20:26 GMT -4
Whats the logic of moving the pick trades here? Pointless to even comment on another player wanting out. So who really benefits from the 1sts that move? My guess at this point is those 1sts will more or less cancel out, based on cycles they should be similar but it's a long way out so kinda pointless to guess. I'd say there is a better chance of them getting the better 1st than us though. I might be eating some crow soon JB because I hate this return.
|
|
|
Post by blueeagle on Dec 23, 2022 17:23:34 GMT -4
I'm really hoping this is still possibly a three-way deal and there is more to come.
I know reducing trades is oversimplifying things, but sending out Desruissault and a 3rd for Newcombe, Campbell, and a 2nd doesn't look good to me.
|
|