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Post by Jack Bauer on Jan 5, 2023 14:49:33 GMT -4
It might seem normal, but when you are dominated shift after shift it hardly looks normal. One of 2 things happen with those types of minutes when you have limited possession and that includes skating the full length of the ice 2-3 times on each of the 8 PPs, you loose offensive ops due to fatigue or you cheat on the defensive side. Eagles had 4 F over 20 mins last night...Cats had no one. Labelle who I absolutely love btw, 20 year old first line center.. rarely plays over 20 mins a night..he plays 17-19 mins the right way, +11 , ppg player. You have other negative effects as well as you're not exactly helping the confidence of the kids at the end of your lineup. I'm not trying to defend it as right. I'm saying thats how this league works and seems like it always works no matter who the coach is. To me this is a young team and there's insanely more return on playing kids more and overagers less. But I admit i'm already of the opinion we could be doing it better but we're focusing on having success this season because that will sell seats apparently. Having internal overagers who have come through your system is the true sign of developing leadership in this league in my opinion. We're already adding overagers in trade for future seasons. Hopefully doing it now has a good outcome and we're not overpaying only to watch the development curve have us back in the trade market trying to upgrade.
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Post by JEagle on Jan 5, 2023 14:57:21 GMT -4
We're talking about line management in a game where the Eagles were down 3-0 by the 8:39 mark of the 2nd period, of course they're gonna over play their guys who score the majority of the teams goals when they obviously have a mandate to make the playoffs I mean they're tied 3rd last in the Overall Standings in Goals For with 116 goals and have no players in the top 20 in Goals.
Johnson - 17G (Tied 24th) Ivan - 13G (Tied 47th) Newcombe - 12G (Tied 51st) Boutin - 11G (Tied 57th) Squires - 10G (Tied 64th) was out sick
The real problem last night was the effort 1 through 18 cause the only one I saw giving an honest effort in my eyes was Ruccia.
And just to go on a small rant here can the so called leadership of this team learn to keep their mouth shut and play hockey this is the second game in a row were we had a 20yo given a 10 minute misconduct cause they couldn't control their emotions. I get getting frustrated with the refs or yapping at your opponent during a game but continuing to flap your jaw especially after the refs give you a warning is only going to get you into trouble and truthfully Goyens needs to step in and put and end to it now.
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Post by Jack Bauer on Jan 5, 2023 15:00:51 GMT -4
We're talking about line management in a game where the Eagles were down 3-0 by the 8:39 mark of the 2nd period, of course they're gonna over play their guys who score the majority of the teams goals when they obviously have a mandate to make the playoffs I mean they're tied 3rd last in the Overall Standings in Goals For with 116 goals and have no players in the top 20 in Goals. Johnson - 17G (Tied 24th) Ivan - 13G (Tied 47th) Newcombe - 12G (Tied 51st) Boutin - 11G (Tied 57th) Squires - 10G (Tied 64th) was out sick The real problem last night was the effort 1 through 18 cause the only one I saw giving an honest effort in my eyes was Ruccia. And just to go on a small rant here can the so called leadership of this team learn to keep their mouth shut and play hockey this is the second game in a row were we had a 20yo given a 10 minute misconduct cause they couldn't control their emotions. I get getting frustrated with the refs or yapping at your opponent during a game but continuing to flap your jaw especially after the refs give you a warning is only going to get you into trouble and truthfully Goyens needs to step in and put and end to it now. You're 100% right. If you're picking your spot...sure take the 10 to get the boys riled up or rallying behind you....but if its a constant its just toxic and pointless when the team is where it is in the standings.
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Post by Citris on Jan 5, 2023 15:52:42 GMT -4
It's hard not to look at what Chicoutimi is doing and see it as what Cape Breton is trying to do... but actually executed well.
Chicoutimi has amassed a good young core (that now includes Desruisseaux) and is surrounding them with CHEAP veterans while still selling off some of their assets to build for the future.
They're competitive on the ice, their rookies are performing, and they haven't been spending unnecessary assets on vets who don't fit the cycle.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 5, 2023 15:55:21 GMT -4
It's hard not to look at what Chicoutimi is doing and see it as what Cape Breton is trying to do... but actually executed well. Chicoutimi has amassed a good young core (that now includes Desruisseaux) and is surrounding them with CHEAP veterans while still selling off some of their assets to build for the future. They're competitive on the ice, their rookies are performing, and they haven't been spending unnecessary assets on vets who don't fit the cycle. Desruisseaux is playing 2nd line center, has 4 pts in 4 games and is not -31 nor is he taking 10 min chirping penalties.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 5, 2023 15:59:14 GMT -4
We're talking about line management in a game where the Eagles were down 3-0 by the 8:39 mark of the 2nd period, of course they're gonna over play their guys who score the majority of the teams goals when they obviously have a mandate to make the playoffs I mean they're tied 3rd last in the Overall Standings in Goals For with 116 goals and have no players in the top 20 in Goals. Johnson - 17G (Tied 24th) Ivan - 13G (Tied 47th) Newcombe - 12G (Tied 51st) Boutin - 11G (Tied 57th) Squires - 10G (Tied 64th) was out sick The real problem last night was the effort 1 through 18 cause the only one I saw giving an honest effort in my eyes was Ruccia. And just to go on a small rant here can the so called leadership of this team learn to keep their mouth shut and play hockey this is the second game in a row were we had a 20yo given a 10 minute misconduct cause they couldn't control their emotions. I get getting frustrated with the refs or yapping at your opponent during a game but continuing to flap your jaw especially after the refs give you a warning is only going to get you into trouble and truthfully Goyens needs to step in and put and end to it now. I agree on the leadership and the effort last night....but we need to stop trying to win games by having 1 line outscore the opponents, it's not hockey, it's not a team effort and it's not working. they are minus players 5 out 6 games. Go back and look how we ended up down 3-0 and then tell me if using the same guys who dug the hole is right thing to do in order to get back out of it. What a terrible message to teach a young team.
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Post by Jack Bauer on Jan 5, 2023 16:00:33 GMT -4
It's hard not to look at what Chicoutimi is doing and see it as what Cape Breton is trying to do... but actually executed well. Chicoutimi has amassed a good young core (that now includes Desruisseaux) and is surrounding them with CHEAP veterans while still selling off some of their assets to build for the future. They're competitive on the ice, their rookies are performing, and they haven't been spending unnecessary assets on vets who don't fit the cycle. Desruisseaux is playing 2nd line center, has 4 pts in 4 games and is not -31 nor is he taking 10 min chirping penalties. Desruisseaux getting top 6 minutes, Repcik on line 3, and still room for an overager if we managed everything differently. The story of this franchise for a decide it seems like.
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Post by Jack Bauer on Jan 5, 2023 16:01:43 GMT -4
It's hard not to look at what Chicoutimi is doing and see it as what Cape Breton is trying to do... but actually executed well. Chicoutimi has amassed a good young core (that now includes Desruisseaux) and is surrounding them with CHEAP veterans while still selling off some of their assets to build for the future. They're competitive on the ice, their rookies are performing, and they haven't been spending unnecessary assets on vets who don't fit the cycle. Charlottetown another example of quietly doing a solid job and picking up assets without giving up 1sts and 2nds.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 5, 2023 16:04:52 GMT -4
You know JB, I thought I could shed some positivity in these discussions...I admit it now, I can't, I am as negative as the next guy now and the more I dive in the more pissed I get. Oh well, time to take a step back, I never joined to be frustrated, I joined for the love of the game.
I am putting myself in time out and will go back to venting over a cold with the boys at the pub!
Leafs1967 OUT!
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Post by JEagle on Jan 5, 2023 16:18:35 GMT -4
We're talking about line management in a game where the Eagles were down 3-0 by the 8:39 mark of the 2nd period, of course they're gonna over play their guys who score the majority of the teams goals when they obviously have a mandate to make the playoffs I mean they're tied 3rd last in the Overall Standings in Goals For with 116 goals and have no players in the top 20 in Goals. Johnson - 17G (Tied 24th) Ivan - 13G (Tied 47th) Newcombe - 12G (Tied 51st) Boutin - 11G (Tied 57th) Squires - 10G (Tied 64th) was out sick The real problem last night was the effort 1 through 18 cause the only one I saw giving an honest effort in my eyes was Ruccia. And just to go on a small rant here can the so called leadership of this team learn to keep their mouth shut and play hockey this is the second game in a row were we had a 20yo given a 10 minute misconduct cause they couldn't control their emotions. I get getting frustrated with the refs or yapping at your opponent during a game but continuing to flap your jaw especially after the refs give you a warning is only going to get you into trouble and truthfully Goyens needs to step in and put and end to it now. I agree on the leadership and the effort last night....but we need to stop trying to win games by having 1 line outscore the opponents, it's not hockey, it's not a team effort and it's not working. they are minus players 5 out 6 games. Go back and look how we ended up down 3-0 and then tell me if using the same guys who dug the hole is right thing to do in order to get back out of it. What a terrible message to teach a young team. I agree with needing to stop trying to have one line out score our opponents all I mean in my post by the goals for statistics is can you really be surprised they're heavily playing our top goal scorers when since Simon was here and seen what's going on there has obviously been a mandate put in place to make the playoffs at damn near any cost.
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Post by Jack Bauer on Jan 5, 2023 16:38:19 GMT -4
I agree on the leadership and the effort last night....but we need to stop trying to win games by having 1 line outscore the opponents, it's not hockey, it's not a team effort and it's not working. they are minus players 5 out 6 games. Go back and look how we ended up down 3-0 and then tell me if using the same guys who dug the hole is right thing to do in order to get back out of it. What a terrible message to teach a young team. I agree with needing to stop trying to have one line out score our opponents all I mean in my post by the goals for statistics is can you really be surprised they're heavily playing our top goal scorers when since Simon was here and seen what's going on there has obviously been a mandate put in place to make the playoffs at damn near any cost. And here's what i'll say to that: There's basically 2 types of owners at this level. Former players/hockey people with knowledge and love of the game and deep understandings of these junior leagues in terms of how to build, age groups, development curves, etc. And super rich people who think owning sports teams is fun. A Bobby Smith in Halifax is a former player who understands junior hockey. And he's got a really close guy in Cam Russell doing the day to day managing who also completely gets it. Moncton has an RKI. More money then he knows what to do with. Has made many mistakes. But look at the money the guy has invested. Always shooting for top talents. And it worked in terms of building an organization that is a staple in the CHL. We have a guy with no hockey knowledge. I believe he'd admit himself he knows basically very little about junior hockey. He's hired, after no actual search I believe, who he believes is a top local mind who understands the league. But there has been no investment. There is a laundry list of embarrassing items just since Gerard has been here that is completely oblivious to our franchise it seems like. But all of that would have been masked with some financial investments. If you own a house worth $50K you dont live in it with no upkeep if you want it to be worth $250K. You invest in the house...maybe a new foundation...a new roof...you dont leave the dirty curtains up. Where have the investments been in this franchise? Getting the #1 pick to report? Or just paying off losses and wondering why?
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Post by Jack Bauer on Jan 5, 2023 16:44:02 GMT -4
You know JB, I thought I could shed some positivity in these discussions...I admit it now, I can't, I am as negative as the next guy now and the more I dive in the more pissed I get. Oh well, time to take a step back, I never joined to be frustrated, I joined for the love of the game. I am putting myself in time out and will go back to venting over a cold with the boys at the pub! Leafs1967 OUT! Just remember: The path coming out of the 2022 draft was clear and just required patience to get through the inevitable rebuild portion of introducing high end kids to the league with no leadership to pull from. They were so bad that they all should have made the owner well aware that another bottom finish was a reality. It took about 25 games and the owner seeing no tickets selling to get everyone on board with playoffs now and winning next year. But the pieces were there to do it right and really peak with what could have been 2 years of excellent results with just basic additions like 1 high end 17yr old European this off season coming up that could grown with the 2022 picks. Also, don't get frustrated yourself. Get mad that these same people have the nerve to call out our fans for not supporting their circus as if we don't know what properly ran teams should look like.
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Post by hal on Jan 5, 2023 17:46:28 GMT -4
I agree with needing to stop trying to have one line out score our opponents all I mean in my post by the goals for statistics is can you really be surprised they're heavily playing our top goal scorers when since Simon was here and seen what's going on there has obviously been a mandate put in place to make the playoffs at damn near any cost. And here's what i'll say to that: There's basically 2 types of owners at this level. Former players/hockey people with knowledge and love of the game and deep understandings of these junior leagues in terms of how to build, age groups, development curves, etc. And super rich people who think owning sports teams is fun. A Bobby Smith in Halifax is a former player who understands junior hockey. And he's got a really close guy in Cam Russell doing the day to day managing who also completely gets it. Moncton has an RKI. More money then he knows what to do with. Has made many mistakes. But look at the money the guy has invested. Always shooting for top talents. And it worked in terms of building an organization that is a staple in the CHL. We have a guy with no hockey knowledge. I believe he'd admit himself he knows basically very little about junior hockey. He's hired, after no actual search I believe, who he believes is a top local mind who understands the league. But there has been no investment. There is a laundry list of embarrassing items just since Gerard has been here that is completely oblivious to our franchise it seems like. But all of that would have been masked with some financial investments. If you own a house worth $50K you dont live in it with no upkeep if you want it to be worth $250K. You invest in the house...maybe a new foundation...a new roof...you dont leave the dirty curtains up. Where have the investments been in this franchise? Getting the #1 pick to report? Or just paying off losses and wondering why? All this does is Bring back Memories of his very first Press Conference where he promised to bring in "World Class " this and "World Class " that in terms of Coaching and Management and I really think that day while sitting on that Stage that he would soon own the Building because he made reference to the Facility and how it would be improved . John Hanna on the Radio said it is time for them to show some PRIDE but the constant in and out of Players and the Lack of Leadership by these 20's begs to ask the question that always seems to be brought up about .....We want People in here who are proud to be Eagles .....Is that even Possible anymore ?
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Post by blueeagle on Jan 6, 2023 8:53:09 GMT -4
You know JB, I thought I could shed some positivity in these discussions...I admit it now, I can't, I am as negative as the next guy now and the more I dive in the more pissed I get. Oh well, time to take a step back, I never joined to be frustrated, I joined for the love of the game. I am putting myself in time out and will go back to venting over a cold with the boys at the pub! Leafs1967 OUT! Pal this sucks, I enjoy your posts as much as anyone else on here. You always willing to talk hockey when this org makes it tempting to just give up and dump on them. It's needed. I understand though, I've left boards for other teams in other sports because they are mostly negative. Hope you're back soon!
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Post by blueeagle on Jan 6, 2023 8:58:08 GMT -4
in junior hockey i have seen very few coaches truly roll 4 lines if your a 4th liner in junior you're lucky if you get more than a handful of shifts Sorry, I phrased this wrong. I didn't mean rolling 4 lines equally - I mean it seems as though Goyens will end games with completely different combinations from where he started it far more often than other coaches I've seen here. Not a criticism, just an observation, and I'm wondering if this is more common in hockey now then it was before. Of course, regularly having guys take misconduct penalties doesn't give you much choice I guess. I agree we rely way too heavily on our top guys right now. And it isn't working, as they are getting torched and are not defensively strong enough to chase the puck for 25 minutes a game. Split em up. Where do you all get access to TOI data? I'm assuming some of you have access to Instat or another paid service.
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