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Post by Jack Bauer on Dec 28, 2022 2:43:17 GMT -4
So what the hell are we looking at for lines assuming Sly is done. Johnson - Ivan - Shields Newcombe - Boutin - Houde Patterson - Squires - Fullarton Henderson - Hébert - Campbell Ex: McCluskey Biggar - Thurston Daigle - Schmitt Shortall - Lavoie Ex: Arnold, Pattengale I was thinking about this a bit earlier. We now have a huge logjam on D with a guy like Arnold who Sly paid good for this summer now forced out. If we were looking to improve for this year and beyond I don't think we've improved at all for the second half of the season. Vs dealing say 7th's for depth...Sly moves 3rds. When you're doing that you inevitable lose more than you win which is a reason bad teams usually go for cheaper depth. We're paying for depth we're already replacing during a 6 month period where we've improved from 18th by far to end last year to 17th now. This stuff is how you end up going for it in 2025 but moving picks in 2027 and 2028 meaning you have a good spring, you better pray, in return for another 3 years like this if you're lucky (being lucky meaning you hope its not longer). This didnt work in Bathurst. They won but they didn't retain ANY fans. Meanwhile Rouyn and Charlottetown are examples that are not hard to replicate. But do involve good scouting, good managing, and good coaching.
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Post by Jack Bauer on Dec 28, 2022 2:49:13 GMT -4
Young teams need vets, leadership. But not at that cost. The point CB is at, they should be shopping in the bargain bins for these guys. Not paying xmas premium ++ prices. Also, its ok to trade picks. You can't use them all. But why so many, and why now? Again, where CB is in their cycle, they should be leveraging top picks at draft time, when teams are desperate. Instead, CB is acting desperate. They've had two good drafts, some major building blocks are in place, let it play out a bit. If this was next year, and they wanted to push things along a bit, I could see the reasoning. But now is not the time to be trading 4 top picks for a character defenseman. Based on what we know about this league chances are high we decide someone passes this guys development as an overager and we want an upgrade if trying to win. Its amazing how short sighted it is all in the name of replacing outgoing veterans for a fan base that isnt changing its tune right now even if you went on a 3 round playoff shocked this spring. I dont understand who they think is seeing this stuff and thinking they're excited to see how it unfolds. Or why they think finishing in say 11th instead of 15th matters in the long run. For a long time now i've said its like this entire franchise operates while either forgetting or ignoring who their compeition is and operates in a bubble where they only evaluate themselves against themselves and not the other 17 teams. This stuff just furthers that and proves how Gerard Shaw is absolutely in over his head and our owner is completely blind to what is happening.
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Post by Jack Bauer on Dec 28, 2022 2:51:29 GMT -4
Young teams need vets, leadership. But not at that cost. The point CB is at, they should be shopping in the bargain bins for these guys. Not paying xmas premium ++ prices. Also, its ok to trade picks. You can't use them all. But why so many, and why now? Again, where CB is in their cycle, they should be leveraging top picks at draft time, when teams are desperate. Instead, CB is acting desperate. They've had two good drafts, some major building blocks are in place, let it play out a bit. If this was next year, and they wanted to push things along a bit, I could see the reasoning. But now is not the time to be trading 4 top picks for a character defenseman. Which is what people have been saying but somehow the Biggar move was “justified” by fans because of the things he brings in the locker room and the fact they need experience on the back end. Like you said, you acquire that on the cheap when you’re a team in the situation Cape Breton is in. You don’t go paying a premium. While the moves are baffling and don’t make sense as a rebuilding team, it’s becoming quite clear they don’t view themselves as a rebuilding team. They want to ice a competitive winning product as soon as possible. While I still don’t think it makes any sense to do what they’re doing, it makes a lot more sense when you consider the guys steering the ship have no intention of rebuilding the right way or probably even know how to do that type of rebuild. I feel bad for the fans of Cape Breton because this is headed down a path they’re all too familiar with, buying from the middle of the pack to try and get a winner because the guys running the operation don’t have the patience necessary to let things play out in a league that turns players over every 5 years. Buying from 17th place is even new to us. This is a new level of incompetence as we've become used to from a Gerard Shaw led team. Only where for some teams this would lead to a couple bad playoff losses and a rebuild...we're risking the franchise with this style of management.
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Post by Jack Bauer on Dec 28, 2022 3:10:26 GMT -4
Is it just me or is there a higher than normal amount of players requesting trades this trade period? Thomas Desruisseaux Brayden Schmitt Jude Campbell Lane Hinkley Are just a few that have requested trades. I dont think its that high at all. This stuff has always happened its just that more of it gets reported now and not all of it 100% accurately. This time of year many guys want to be closer to home. Some vets for schooling reasons. And it goes both ways that sometimes guys want to be near certain Universities to do it in their chosen language. Some want out because of playing time. Some just home sick.
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Post by hal on Dec 28, 2022 6:45:32 GMT -4
This is a tough day. One of the lowest I can remember. We've essentially abandoned a rebuild that really started picking #1 overall just 6 months ago. The building blocks were in place....as long as we had just a small bit of patience to get over this last hump all signs were there to keep rebuilding properly and start seeing some results next year. The complete short sighted lack of patience to drive dozens of seat sales now and next year vs rebuilding the fan base with the youth and going for bigger commitments for 24-25/25-26 as the team turned toward a contender is absolutely deflating. The table was set here. Future picks in place to keep the farm system producing talent with vets to move now and have 1 last big sale while our 1st rounders got ice time. But we even had to move one of them before the calendar turned to a new year. I see lots of talk how this does line up with the core as it's acquiring a 20 for 24-25. Which assumes the player wants to be here 2.5 years. Assumes the player we just paid top dollar for is a returning 19yr old which begs the question of why to pay the price if the player has those flaws. Our 2024 pick is a question mark. But the combo of the 4 picks means we moved 4 top 30 picks basically for this player. Halifax acquired 2 20's this year...proven talent...an elite #1 C and the leagues 2nd leading scorer. Cost: 18yr old former 2nd rounder, 1st 23 and 24, 2nd 23 and 24, 3rd 23. We traded 4 top assets for an 18yr old we think could be a 20. A stud 20 costs 2-3 top assets and 1 of those is your contending year 1st....everyone can draw their own conclusions as to which team is managing things better. These people are leaving this fan base in a position to either support the worst managed team in the CHL or blame themselves for losing their hockey team. I hope it works. What other choice do we have? I know that Stallone is the guy who is pulling the trigger but is he acting or performing his way because of the presence of a Very Deep Pocketed Owner that is pressuring his Hockey Ops People through Teflon Shaw or is this all on Courtourier because as some of the Bathurst Posters have said before .....it's his Crazy Style ? All I know is that Goyens has his work cut out for him and I am still gonna need a Program to figure out ...Who the Hell is playing for my own Team .
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Post by sc74 on Dec 28, 2022 8:46:43 GMT -4
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Post by jboyz on Dec 28, 2022 9:02:49 GMT -4
Possible roster for next year is looking like:
Newcombe-Boutin-Houde Patterson-Squires-Shields Euro-Henderson-Campbell Fullerton-Aucoin-X
Daigle-Lavoie Biggar-Schmitt Waugh-Shortall X-Arnold, Desjardins
Ruccia Euro/Cloutier/Labbe
Still some big question marks with what player(s) we'll be getting from Quebec and the euro situation.
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ap
Draft Pick
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Post by ap on Dec 28, 2022 10:57:26 GMT -4
Can anyone who has really followed the league for years actually say they are surprised to see this from Syl? Full credit for the Mem Cup win….but it was a constant disaster in AB with a million trades.
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Post by Captain Obvious on Dec 28, 2022 11:04:03 GMT -4
Can anyone who has really followed the league for years actually say they are surprised to see this from Syl? Full credit for the Mem Cup win….but it was a constant disaster in AB with a million trades. The last 5-6 years Couturier had in Bathurst, they built up to a Presidents cup and Memorial Cup and then started a rebuild that got the Melanson Kidney Biggar Gaudet Tourigny Lafrance Lapierre Allison MacArthur etc He built two legit contenders in 5 years. The LGM years previous to current ownership were a bit of a shitshow for sure. I wonder if the CB owner pushed for him to accelerate the rebuild and he is just following orders?
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Post by Eagles933 on Dec 28, 2022 11:39:34 GMT -4
This has Irwin Simon and Gerard Shaw written all over it. We seen it in 18/19 when they overpaid for Gentile and Boudrias in a non contending year. Yes they were both returning and contributing in 19/20 but they or similar players could have been acquired for a fraction of the price at the draft or Christmas.
Sly has been pretty transparent with what the plan is and when they want to contend. Now all of a sudden things change. Maybe it’s just a coincidence the owner was here last month and watched a last place team in an empty rink. Since Gerard Shaw has taken over none of the actual hockey people in this organization have been able to do their job.
There are still lots of assets left and this thing isn’t completely off the rails yet but it sure looks like it could be headed that way. I’m scared to see what they will do at the draft and next Christmas. On paper they are a middle of the pack team next year and with the style we’ve seen since 2018 will probably try to buy their way to the top next year sacrificing what should be 2 contending years in 24/25 and 25/26 with some assets left to start the rebuild the following season.
At the end of this thing there most likely won’t be any assets left and it will be a long rebuild once again. One that may even cost us the franchise. And the state that the fan base is in we are a 1st or 2nd round upset in 2026 from complete disaster regardless of the assets we have left.
I will continue to give Sly the benefit of the doubt as I’m sure he’s just taking orders and I hope even with this style he can build a contender and a winner. I just hope it’s not at the cost of the team.
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Post by Reesor on Dec 28, 2022 11:46:38 GMT -4
The Schmitt deal looks like a big risk that the player will turn into a top 20 year old defenseman. He was Blainville's captain if I recall correctly. Should add some leadership for sure. But man that's a steep price to pay for leadership and some potential. Everything Cape Breton is doing seems to be pointing towards 24-25. I bet a Memorial Cup bid is coming up whenever that window opens. Someone tell Paul MacDonald when that window is.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2022 12:06:10 GMT -4
A couple of things I find very frustrating as I follow the Eagles, the fans and all passion on these boards. The fans have basically said by current ticket sales they are not coming back until we have a winning team, which causes Simon to pull strings forcing the hand of management to react and try to make the play-offs now vs a proper re-build. I personally see this more in the way the team is being coached vs what Sly is actually doing.
Let's look at the Langlois deal. Was this deal based on what Langlois wanted or what was best for the Eagles, more importantly is the return in line of what he is really worth or what we the fans think he is worth. We pick apart the deal like we should have done way better, but maybe, just maybe we took what we could get. Langlois is without question playing way below his potential, so if I am a GM I am not overpaying for a player is playing worse at 19 then he was at 17. Does anyone actually think that Langlois is 9 months away from playing pro hockey as a 20? At this point I am not confident he will even play top 4 in QUE. We look at him as the 17 year old that had Pro potential, but with 6 points 5v5 in 27 games, I am not convinced we got anymore then we deserved.
Desruisseaux (Newcombe) now with a 2nd 1st coming in, love the deal. I don't love the fact that he wanted out, but Cape is not the only team going thru these type of requests.
Biggar - still like the deal, although no one agrees with me
Schmitt - This one boggles my mind, the only thing I can see is we got into a bidding war with another team and we were dead set on getting him here in CB, so we overpaid.
What I can say about all this, if you look at the way Langlois was playing currently and the fact that Buteau is extremely overrated, we are better today then yesterday on the back end. Did we overpay to get there, yes by 2 2nd round picks in my opinion.
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Post by Score on Dec 28, 2022 12:09:34 GMT -4
Maybe Sly will move Squires to Charlottetown for a few 18yr olds.
To CB: Jelley-18 Allen-18 Todd-18 Vos-18
To Charlottetown; Squires
🤣
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Post by eagleeye on Dec 28, 2022 12:30:07 GMT -4
i think the owner wanted to get in the playoffs and hope to win a round ,but that part will be hard .and the owner has that right
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peter
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Post by peter on Dec 28, 2022 12:30:17 GMT -4
A couple of things I find very frustrating as I follow the Eagles, the fans and all passion on these boards. The fans have basically said by current ticket sales they are not coming back until we have a winning team, which causes Simon to pull strings forcing the hand of management to react and try to make the play-offs now vs a proper re-build. I personally see this more in the way the team is being coached vs what Sly is actually doing. Let's look at the Langlois deal. Was this deal based on what Langlois wanted or what was best for the Eagles, more importantly is the return in line of what he is really worth or what we the fans think he is worth. We pick apart the deal like we should have done way better, but maybe, just maybe we took what we could get. Langlois is without question playing way below his potential, so if I am a GM I am not overpaying for a player is playing worse at 19 then he was at 17. Does anyone actually think that Langlois is 9 months away from playing pro hockey as a 20? At this point I am not confident he will even play top 4 in QUE. We look at him as the 17 year old that had Pro potential, but with 6 points 5v5 in 27 games, I am not convinced we got anymore then we deserved. Desruisseaux (Newcombe) now with a 2nd 1st coming in, love the deal. I don't love the fact that he wanted out, but Cape is not the only team going thru these type of requests. Biggar - still like the deal, although no one agrees with me Schmitt - This one boggles my mind, the only thing I can see is we got into a bidding war with another team and we were dead set on getting him here in CB, so we overpaid. What I can say about all this, if you look at the way Langlois was playing currently and the fact that Buteau is extremely overrated, we are better today then yesterday on the back end. Did we overpay to get there, yes by 2 2nd round picks in my opinion. I thought Langlois's game picked up a lot over the past month. I believe he had 10 points in his last 9 games. We'll wait and see how he performs with a better defensive core. Great deal for the Remparts. Not so much for the Eagles.
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