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Post by Deleted on Dec 7, 2014 23:59:43 GMT -4
So in 2012-2013 Fucale was giving up 5 goals a game huh... if you going to hate on the kid at least make some claims that can be supported by facts. According to you he gave up well above 200 goals that season... actual stats show he have up 124 goals in 55 games. The Mooseheads only gave up just under 25 shots a game in which he played but the proportion of those shots which were considered dangerous would have been relatively higher than say a goalie like Cadorette as Baie Comeau played a tighter defensive game. I know I'm not going to get a Moncton hater like yourself to change their mind- Fucale plays for Halifax, Fucale sucks blah blah blag. But for those of us who have watched him for 3 and a half years now we know how he came up big for us in the Memorial Cup final game and along the way. Even this year he isn't giving up 5 goals a game... you are so full of shit!!! I was referring to the Memorial Cup ... he gave up 15 goals in 4 games ... but his team scored more than that so it didn't matter. Oh yeah ... tell us about that one save he made. In the regular season ... no teams had the puck long enough to score 5 goals ... a monkey could have tended goal for Halifax and they win in a walk. Yeah you can be sarcastic about the save he made in the championship game. Point is that Fucale is a big time goalie whether you like it or not- he got the job done and is a Memorial Cup champion unlike Tjordman (whatever his name was) and Riopel.
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Post by lirette on Dec 8, 2014 9:35:13 GMT -4
I was referring to the Memorial Cup ... he gave up 15 goals in 4 games ... but his team scored more than that so it didn't matter. Oh yeah ... tell us about that one save he made. In the regular season ... no teams had the puck long enough to score 5 goals ... a monkey could have tended goal for Halifax and they win in a walk. Yeah you can be sarcastic about the save he made in the championship game. Point is that Fucale is a big time goalie whether you like it or not- he got the job done and is a Memorial Cup champion unlike Tjordman (whatever his name was) and Riopel. Riopel was sick during the Memorial Cup, he never had any chance to try and win it. He was busy sitting behind the boards looking Pale as Casper.
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Post by SteveUL on Dec 8, 2014 9:50:27 GMT -4
I was referring to the Memorial Cup ... he gave up 15 goals in 4 games ... but his team scored more than that so it didn't matter. Oh yeah ... tell us about that one save he made. In the regular season ... no teams had the puck long enough to score 5 goals ... a monkey could have tended goal for Halifax and they win in a walk. That team is reaching mythical status. We were good, but it's not like every game was a walk in the park, 50-10 shot game. There was a month where Ciampini/Ashley/Boudreau was our number 1 line for example. Our defense core was not even that good to a man, as it was fairly young and inexperienced overall (Weegar, Murphy, Hardie in particular). I've never said Fucale wasn't a good goaltender ... he is ... but he isn't nearly as good as all the hype he gets. People keep saying he is a big game goaltender ... but in the big games I have seen he hasn't been great (again ... don't confuse that term for me saying "he sucked"). I'd be happy to have Fucale on my team ... but so many excellent Q goaltenders have come and gone that were better than him but didn't get the same attention because they didn't play on a strong team. Bibeau and Auger were better than him over the past 2 seasons ... but played on shitty teams so didn't get the recognition. And that is just in the Maritime division ... I have seen those guys play several games so I am comfortable making that comparison. Harder to say how he compares to goaltenders on Quebec teams when you don't see them very often.
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Post by Murph on Dec 8, 2014 10:41:31 GMT -4
It's getting to the point where Fucale is becoming under-rated on the message boards, not over-rated. The guy was fantastic as a 16 year old, and was the reason why Halifax had their deep run. And so the hype machine began. He's been very inconsistent since then, and his "talent" projects into the NHL higher than the performance has translated which leads to hype as a prospect. People in junior tend to have issue with this, because the results fans see with their eyes, don't match up with how much they read about him. His stats aren't as good as his performance has been, while at the same token, his performance isn't what you'd expect it to be, when you hear as much about him as you do.
One game that maybe sums up Fucale.... a 9-6 win vs Rouyn as a 17 year old in the playoffs. He was the reason Halifax won that game, and how often can you say that about a team that scored 9, and their goalie gave up 6? Rouyn was all over Halifax early, and could have been blown out. Rouyn had a couple goals, but two of their first 3 goals went into the Mooseheads net off of Moosehead players. He stoped breakaway after breakaway, high end chance after high end chance. Halifax had an onslaught early in the 3rd to take control of the game and then RN had a couple late ones after Halifax started coasting. Fucale got 2nd star in a game, on the road when he gave up 6 goals. That's a situation where the people their who saw the game knew how good he was (2nd star) but the "stats" group on the message boards see "6".
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Post by CrazyJoeDavola on Dec 8, 2014 10:54:39 GMT -4
It's getting to the point where Fucale is becoming under-rated on the message boards, not over-rated. I agree... it's fine if someone wants to say he is overrated by Hockey Canada (and I guess the NHL?) but he is underrated on these boards. Moose fans don't usually make a huge deal about him and don't pretend he was the MVP to winning a Memorial Cup. But game after game you feel pretty confident seeing him head to the crease, and you know he will make most of the saves he is supposed to and many other good ones - like top goaltenders do. He has tons of star performances, on hockeys biggest hockey stages, to back up the claim he is better than his numbers sometime suggest. Maybe, he is too fast for da ligue.
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Post by Judas In My Mind on Dec 8, 2014 11:03:07 GMT -4
I have nothing against Fucale....other than it seems like every thread on these boards somehow ends up turning into a discussion over how good or bad he actually is. He's got to be the most discussed player ever and if you combined all the threads that are about someone else but ended up being about Fucale, we'd likely have a thread that blows away the old "Drouin watch" thread.
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Post by Penguins23® on Dec 8, 2014 11:04:44 GMT -4
It's getting to the point where Fucale is becoming under-rated on the message boards, not over-rated. The guy was fantastic as a 16 year old, and was the reason why Halifax had their deep run. And so the hype machine began. He's been very inconsistent since then, and his "talent" projects into the NHL higher than the performance has translated which leads to hype as a prospect. People in junior tend to have issue with this, because the results fans see with their eyes, don't match up with how much they read about him. His stats aren't as good as his performance has been, while at the same token, his performance isn't what you'd expect it to be, when you hear as much about him as you do. One game that maybe sums up Fucale.... a 9-6 win vs Rouyn as a 17 year old in the playoffs. He was the reason Halifax won that game, and how often can you say that about a team that scored 9, and their goalie gave up 6? Rouyn was all over Halifax early, and could have been blown out. Rouyn had a couple goals, but two of their first 3 goals went into the Mooseheads net off of Moosehead players. He stoped breakaway after breakaway, high end chance after high end chance. Halifax had an onslaught early in the 3rd to take control of the game and then RN had a couple late ones after Halifax started coasting. Fucale got 2nd star in a game, on the road when he gave up 6 goals. That's a situation where the people their who saw the game knew how good he was (2nd star) but the "stats" group on the message boards see "6". Again, how long ago is that? Has he improved since then? No one is denying he's got talent and played great at 16 and 17. Everyone will admit that. It's more of a what have you done for me lately type thing. And this is what is most recent in people's minds right now. theqmjhl.ca/schedule/show/game/67174theqmjhl.ca/schedule/show/game/67175theqmjhl.ca/schedule/show/game/67178theqmjhl.ca/schedule/show/game/67179To sum it up, he played 6 games in that Foreurs series and his BEST game statistically was a .880 save percentage. Second best was .818
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topnet
Blue-Chip Prospect
Posts: 310
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Post by topnet on Dec 8, 2014 11:10:12 GMT -4
Shouldn't there be a new thread dedicated to whether Fucale is good or not, hot or cold, improving or plateauing out? I had to go back to check to see what the actual topic of this thread was.
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Post by Briwhel on Dec 8, 2014 11:14:59 GMT -4
I have nothing against Fucale....other than it seems like every thread on these boards somehow ends up turning into a discussion over how good or bad he actually is. He's got to be the most discussed player ever and if you combined all the threads that are about someone else but ended up being about Fucale, we'd likely have a thread that blows away the old "Drouin watch" thread. He isn't quite up there with the "Golden Boy" For those saying Fucale is underrated. He is currently 12th in GAA and 14th in Save %. While nobody on here believes he is truly that bad, the comments started with Quebec saying they would only move Booth (5th in Save %, 8th in GAA) for him when in reality, Auger, Montembault, Whitney, Cupper, Desrosiers, and McDonald have all clearly outperformed him this year and I would personally take Dubeau before Fucale too. As much as we make a big deal about slots, when you are going for it, you don't value an inferior goalie at this level higher because he takes less (especially when you are using a slot on a non-PPG character 20).
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Post by SteveUL on Dec 8, 2014 11:40:03 GMT -4
I have nothing against Fucale....other than it seems like every thread on these boards somehow ends up turning into a discussion over how good or bad he actually is. He's got to be the most discussed player ever and if you combined all the threads that are about someone else but ended up being about Fucale, we'd likely have a thread that blows away the old "Drouin watch" thread. He isn't quite up there with the "Golden Boy" For those saying Fucale is underrated. He is currently 12th in GAA and 14th in Save %. While nobody on here believes he is truly that bad, the comments started with Quebec saying they would only move Booth (5th in Save %, 8th in GAA) for him when in reality, Auger, Montembault, Whitney, Cupper, Desrosiers, and McDonald have all clearly outperformed him this year and I would personally take Dubeau before Fucale too. As much as we make a big deal about slots, when you are going for it, you don't value an inferior goalie at this level higher because he takes less (especially when you are using a slot on a non-PPG character 20). Mason McDonald is another guy that hasn't really performed up to the hype yet. He played a solid game vs Moncton the other night ... but most nights I see him he is just ordinary ... and often not very good. I know it is more about his size and athleticism why he is hyped ... but I'm left waiting for him to put a bunch of games together where he really stands out. He hasn't played on a strong team yet in his Q career ... although this years Islanders should be better than they have been. I just don't see him making much of a difference yet. On Dubeau ... he certainly can be great and he has been lights out many times for Moncton over his time here ... but in year one here he really struggled mentally and would get angry too easily and lose his focus ... year two he was sensational most of the year and was a real difference maker for us ... this season he isn't losing his cool (most nights) but seems to have a few moments in every game where he loses focus and lets in softies that he normally saves. I think his consistency is what keeps us behind SJ ... that and injuries to two key players for the last 2 months (players that are now gone). If I'm looking for a 20 YO goaltender this year as a contending team ... Dubeau is probably not my first choice ... and probably not a guy I'd want to pin my season on.
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Post by CrazyJoeDavola on Dec 8, 2014 11:51:32 GMT -4
It's getting to the point where Fucale is becoming under-rated on the message boards, not over-rated. The guy was fantastic as a 16 year old, and was the reason why Halifax had their deep run. And so the hype machine began. He's been very inconsistent since then, and his "talent" projects into the NHL higher than the performance has translated which leads to hype as a prospect. People in junior tend to have issue with this, because the results fans see with their eyes, don't match up with how much they read about him. His stats aren't as good as his performance has been, while at the same token, his performance isn't what you'd expect it to be, when you hear as much about him as you do. One game that maybe sums up Fucale.... a 9-6 win vs Rouyn as a 17 year old in the playoffs. He was the reason Halifax won that game, and how often can you say that about a team that scored 9, and their goalie gave up 6? Rouyn was all over Halifax early, and could have been blown out. Rouyn had a couple goals, but two of their first 3 goals went into the Mooseheads net off of Moosehead players. He stoped breakaway after breakaway, high end chance after high end chance. Halifax had an onslaught early in the 3rd to take control of the game and then RN had a couple late ones after Halifax started coasting. Fucale got 2nd star in a game, on the road when he gave up 6 goals. That's a situation where the people their who saw the game knew how good he was (2nd star) but the "stats" group on the message boards see "6". Again, how long ago is that? Has he improved since then? No one is denying he's got talent and played great at 16 and 17. Everyone will admit that. It's more of a what have you done for me lately type thing. And this is what is most recent in people's minds right now. theqmjhl.ca/schedule/show/game/67174theqmjhl.ca/schedule/show/game/67175theqmjhl.ca/schedule/show/game/67178theqmjhl.ca/schedule/show/game/67179To sum it up, he played 6 games in that Foreurs series and his BEST game statistically was a .880 save percentage. Second best was .818 Its not really fair to point at the numbers from his bad series'. VD were an opportunistic team with the leagues best sniper as well and lots of offense from the blueline through screens. Cadorette had a 3.42 GA and .888 % against them - and he was on the best team in the league with a MUCH better defense than Halifax. The last time Auger was in the playoffs, he had a 6.00 GA and .880 %
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Post by Briwhel on Dec 8, 2014 12:17:17 GMT -4
Its not really fair to point at the numbers from his bad series'. VD were an opportunistic team with the leagues best sniper as well and lots of offense from the blueline through screens. Cadorette had a 3.42 GA and .888 % against them - and he was on the best team in the league with a MUCH better defense than Halifax. The last time Auger was in the playoffs, he had a 6.00 GA and .880 % It was actually an .883 which was better than Fucale's last year And that was against the big bad Mooseheads in their big year.
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Post by Don Draper on Dec 8, 2014 12:29:11 GMT -4
He's got to be the most discussed player ever Ever hear of a guy named Kevin Cormier?
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Post by TA1 Sports on Dec 8, 2014 15:16:26 GMT -4
Might as well throw this year out guys. Zach has played in front of a junior A/Midget level defense core with the exception of Murphy and Hardie. I believe Halifax is also last in the league killing penalties.
Could he have played better during a few games this year? For sure, but you can hang the poor numbers completely on him, just like he doesn't get, or deserve all the credit for the teams success in 2012-2013.
Throw him on some of the better built teams in the Q and those numbers get better and he likely gives the team a great shot at the President Cup.
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Post by SteveUL on Dec 8, 2014 16:06:05 GMT -4
Might as well throw this year out guys. Zach has played in front of a junior A/Midget level defense core with the exception of Murphy and Hardie. I believe Halifax is also last in the league killing penalties. Could he have played better during a few games this year? For sure, but you can hang the poor numbers completely on him, just like he doesn't get, or deserve all the credit for the teams success in 2012-2013. Throw him on some of the better built teams in the Q and those numbers get better and he likely gives the team a great shot at the President Cup. What do you think Bibeau and Auger have played in front of for the past 2 seasons ? Actually ... it is when the goaltender faces that ton of quality chances that he shows his true mettle ... stands on his head ... shows what all of the fuss is about. Fucale doesn't do that often ... not often enough anyways. He has been in front of strong teams for the past 2 years ... and his numbers were artificially inflated. To me ... the only true number is the Sv% ... GAA is a team stat that is greatly affected by the quality of the team. Sv% is also affected because there are normally more quality chances on a weaker team, but that is the best number that we have that is pretty much a true reflection on the goaltender. GAA is a lousy number to use to evaluate a goaltender ... especially on a strong team. There use to be a number called "goalie index" or something like that ... it considered GAA, Sv% and a few other variables that I can't recall ... but I don't hear many quoting it so I can't really comment on its validity.
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