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Trump
Nov 3, 2020 16:17:07 GMT -4
Post by SteveUL on Nov 3, 2020 16:17:07 GMT -4
Trump got elected in 2016 because a big part of America (enough to get him elected) wanted something different than the canned politically-correct typical politician BS. Trump is the exact opposite of that as we all know. But now that they have had that for 4 yrs, they are re-thinking that decision and many of his original supporters are switching sides. It should be a Biden victory, but may get tied up in court for months. But we thought Hilary had it won also at this time 4 yrs ago. If Trump wins tonight/tomorrow (whenever all the votes are counted) I fear for what may happen in the streets of America. In 2016 there were also parts of the country that felt left out or forgotten in the Obama years. Places like Michigan which never really recovered from the 2008 collapse. The 2008 Obama election had record involvement and hope. When you win by that much and inspire so many there is only one direction things can go. People woke up from the dream and some felt left behind which opened door to candidate Trump. Hillary only campaigned in the states that Democrats didnt take for granted. The people in places like Michigan/Wisconsin stayed home or voted in protest for someone who said what they wanted to hear like "I will bring jobs back from Mexico and redo these bad trade deals". Biden may win tonight. He hasn't had to work for it but already 50% of Ameticans have cast votes. That's Obama level engagement by people. What will they do when a year down the road they wake up and realize Biden is president? These parties lack real leaders with real ideas. I dont expect much from a 78 year old president. It opens the door for another populist to arise in 4 years I think Harris will be President in two years as Biden will be declared unfit mentally to continue in the job. But Pence would be President in two years also if they won, because somebody will probably assassinate Trump before his next four years are over. Its a sad state of affairs when these are the two options. Reminds me of Trudeau vs Scheer but a much bigger scale.
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Trump
Nov 3, 2020 17:52:15 GMT -4
via mobile
Post by yesisaiditfirst on Nov 3, 2020 17:52:15 GMT -4
In 2016 there were also parts of the country that felt left out or forgotten in the Obama years. Places like Michigan which never really recovered from the 2008 collapse. The 2008 Obama election had record involvement and hope. When you win by that much and inspire so many there is only one direction things can go. People woke up from the dream and some felt left behind which opened door to candidate Trump. Hillary only campaigned in the states that Democrats didnt take for granted. The people in places like Michigan/Wisconsin stayed home or voted in protest for someone who said what they wanted to hear like "I will bring jobs back from Mexico and redo these bad trade deals". Biden may win tonight. He hasn't had to work for it but already 50% of Ameticans have cast votes. That's Obama level engagement by people. What will they do when a year down the road they wake up and realize Biden is president? These parties lack real leaders with real ideas. I dont expect much from a 78 year old president. It opens the door for another populist to arise in 4 years I think Harris will be President in two years as Biden will be declared unfit mentally to continue in the job. But Pence would be President in two years also if they won, because somebody will probably assassinate Trump before his next four years are over. Its a sad state of affairs when these are the two options. Reminds me of Trudeau vs Scheer but a much bigger scale. Biden
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Trump
Nov 4, 2020 0:28:15 GMT -4
Post by hal on Nov 4, 2020 0:28:15 GMT -4
UH - OH .......
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Trump
Nov 4, 2020 9:22:22 GMT -4
Post by Captain Obvious on Nov 4, 2020 9:22:22 GMT -4
UH - OH ....... Biden looks favored, but it's closer than I thought. He could win without Penn or Georgia. The late counting of early votes skews the results.
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Trump
Nov 4, 2020 9:45:18 GMT -4
via mobile
Post by scotiahockey on Nov 4, 2020 9:45:18 GMT -4
UH - OH ....... Biden looks favored, but it's closer than I thought. He could win without Penn or Georgia. The late counting of early votes skews the results. People love to vocally hate Trump but the reality of the matter is that both candidates are awful. That’s going to lead to more people not vocalizing the fact they’ll vote for Trump and the polls making it seem like Biden would win in a cake walk. This is the 2nd time the Democratic Party has had a lob ball just waiting for them to hit a home run and they haven’t. That says a lot about their candidates IMO. If they actually had someone good running in either of these elections, they knock it out of the park. This is a literal coin flip at this point, I think Biden wins but I also wouldn’t bet my house on it like many would have 24 hours ago.
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Post by SteveUL on Nov 4, 2020 10:15:03 GMT -4
I watched CNN last night and this morning. I cringe when they use the term "we" to talk about the democrat votes. When I was a kid the media was all about reporting the truth, and stayed away from opinion and bias as best they could. CNN kept saying that there is a tremendous divide in the country, and I am baffled that they don't see that they create that divide with the their slanted reporting. Its very frustrating to watch.
But as I watch things change this morning, it looked like Trump was headed to surprising victory (again) last night when I went to bed around 1:30. But now its all of these mail in votes that are being counted and slowing down the process, and I get that it is a new process in this election so their will be wrinkles. Here are some questions I have that have me baffled:
1. Why are we still waiting for 7 or 8 states when all of the western states are done and have finalized results? It makes no sense to me that it is taking this long for some states, but states with larger populations finished with little delay. I know we expected delays, but I'm not understanding it.
2. CNN is saying that all of these Mail in ballots are going to be heavy on Democratic voters, and that could bring Biden back into a winning margin. Not impossible for sure. But why is it that Democratic voters wanted a mail in ballot but Republican voters did not ? Makes no sense unless the Dems have loaded the ballot box with fake mail in ballots. It seems statistically improbable when everything about this election is almost split 50-50.
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Trump
Nov 4, 2020 10:48:38 GMT -4
Post by catnut on Nov 4, 2020 10:48:38 GMT -4
I watched CNN last night and this morning. I cringe when they use the term "we" to talk about the democrat votes. When I was a kid the media was all about reporting the truth, and stayed away from opinion and bias as best they could. CNN kept saying that there is a tremendous divide in the country, and I am baffled that they don't see that they create that divide with the their slanted reporting. Its very frustrating to watch. But as I watch things change this morning, it looked like Trump was headed to surprising victory (again) last night when I went to bed around 1:30. But now its all of these mail in votes that are being counted and slowing down the process, and I get that it is a new process in this election so their will be wrinkles. Here are some questions I have that have me baffled: 1. Why are we still waiting for 7 or 8 states when all of the western states are done and have finalized results? It makes no sense to me that it is taking this long for some states, but states with larger populations finished with little delay. I know we expected delays, but I'm not understanding it. 2. CNN is saying that all of these Mail in ballots are going to be heavy on Democratic voters, and that could bring Biden back into a winning margin. Not impossible for sure. But why is it that Democratic voters wanted a mail in ballot but Republican voters did not ? Makes no sense unless the Dems have loaded the ballot box with fake mail in ballots. It seems statistically improbable when everything about this election is almost split 50-50. Mail-in votes are not a new thing. It has been present for many US elections before. However, they are much more common in this year of the Covid. For your 1st point. Each state has different electoral laws. Some states can start counting these absentee ballots early while others cannot open them until election night. Also, if you look at the vote count in each state, they are roughly at the same % of votes counted but those that are decided have a higher difference in the votes. For your 2nd point. Democratic voters are more COVID cautious and tend to vote more remotely. Republicans tend to vote in person on election day.
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Trump
Nov 4, 2020 10:56:09 GMT -4
via mobile
Post by yesisaiditfirst on Nov 4, 2020 10:56:09 GMT -4
I watched CNN last night and this morning. I cringe when they use the term "we" to talk about the democrat votes. When I was a kid the media was all about reporting the truth, and stayed away from opinion and bias as best they could. CNN kept saying that there is a tremendous divide in the country, and I am baffled that they don't see that they create that divide with the their slanted reporting. Its very frustrating to watch. But as I watch things change this morning, it looked like Trump was headed to surprising victory (again) last night when I went to bed around 1:30. But now its all of these mail in votes that are being counted and slowing down the process, and I get that it is a new process in this election so their will be wrinkles. Here are some questions I have that have me baffled: 1. Why are we still waiting for 7 or 8 states when all of the western states are done and have finalized results? It makes no sense to me that it is taking this long for some states, but states with larger populations finished with little delay. I know we expected delays, but I'm not understanding it. 2. CNN is saying that all of these Mail in ballots are going to be heavy on Democratic voters, and that could bring Biden back into a winning margin. Not impossible for sure. But why is it that Democratic voters wanted a mail in ballot but Republican voters did not ? Makes no sense unless the Dems have loaded the ballot box with fake mail in ballots. It seems statistically improbable when everything about this election is almost split 50-50. So the US is really 50 small elections and every state has different rules and many are seeing elevated mail in phenomenon for the first time. The way the ballots are authenticated, distributed and counted is different in each state. However candidates for president apply to be on the ballot in each state and sign up for this. A bigger issue to me is the instability in world markets not getting it counted all at the same time. There are people making bets on this online. So as new ways of voting are developed and agreed on (they arent really agreed on) the system has to keep up. Big states like Florida have voting differences by county and have adapted a big system to do it fast. Other backwoods states like Wisconsin just dont have it together. County mayors stop counting or interfere. The loading of ballot box would slow down the count. It's illegal but when society moves too fast checks and balances sometimes dont keep up and that's where legal challenges happen if it's close. Media make lots of assumptions about who the mail in votes are for. They go based on which precinct the mail in vote was requested from. If its a place that goes 80% democrat historically they use that as their data. The biggest failing of the media in this election and in 2016 is they overvalue polls. Polling is not capturing reality. It's getting worse. And I think most media people live in cities. Everyone in their social circles are on similar wavelength politically on issues. They have no idea what a lumberjack in upper michigan sees of fears. They do not represent all views. How could they? Lots of assumptions and stereotypes that they buy in and it paints a picture the real results often rebuke. The urban/ rural contrast in north america is just night and day on many issues. 75% of counties vote republican but 90% or urban ares are democrat. The map doesnt lie.
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Trump
Nov 4, 2020 11:10:41 GMT -4
Post by SteveUL on Nov 4, 2020 11:10:41 GMT -4
I watched CNN last night and this morning. I cringe when they use the term "we" to talk about the democrat votes. When I was a kid the media was all about reporting the truth, and stayed away from opinion and bias as best they could. CNN kept saying that there is a tremendous divide in the country, and I am baffled that they don't see that they create that divide with the their slanted reporting. Its very frustrating to watch. But as I watch things change this morning, it looked like Trump was headed to surprising victory (again) last night when I went to bed around 1:30. But now its all of these mail in votes that are being counted and slowing down the process, and I get that it is a new process in this election so their will be wrinkles. Here are some questions I have that have me baffled: 1. Why are we still waiting for 7 or 8 states when all of the western states are done and have finalized results? It makes no sense to me that it is taking this long for some states, but states with larger populations finished with little delay. I know we expected delays, but I'm not understanding it. 2. CNN is saying that all of these Mail in ballots are going to be heavy on Democratic voters, and that could bring Biden back into a winning margin. Not impossible for sure. But why is it that Democratic voters wanted a mail in ballot but Republican voters did not ? Makes no sense unless the Dems have loaded the ballot box with fake mail in ballots. It seems statistically improbable when everything about this election is almost split 50-50. For your 2nd point. Democratic voters are more COVID cautious and tend to vote more remotely. Republicans tend to vote in person on election day. Yup ... that's what CNN alluded to. But statistically I find it to be BS. If anybody in the US was actually COVID cautious they wouldn't be in the quite the mess they are in now, especially in Democratic strongholds. Is it just Republicans getting COVID ? There are COVID cautious people on both sides of the dividing line. I'm not buying the large imbalance in mail in votes when the rest of the voters are roughly split down 50-50 lines.
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Trump
Nov 4, 2020 11:19:33 GMT -4
Post by catnut on Nov 4, 2020 11:19:33 GMT -4
For your 2nd point. Democratic voters are more COVID cautious and tend to vote more remotely. Republicans tend to vote in person on election day. Yup ... that's what CNN alluded to. But statistically I find it to be BS. If anybody in the US was actually COVID cautious they wouldn't be in the quite the mess they are in now, especially in Democratic strongholds. Is it just Republicans getting COVID ? There are COVID cautious people on both sides of the dividing line. I'm not buying the large imbalance in mail in votes when the rest of the voters are roughly split down 50-50 lines. Democrats are more popular in large cities while Republicans are more popular in rural areas. Smaller towns are more accessible to vote on election day so people will go vote on that day more often. In cities, people will try to avoid long lines and vote ahead. Regarding the COVID, Trump followers are following his lead and not worrying about it (no masks, big rallies, etc.) while Biden was preaching caution.
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Trump
Nov 4, 2020 11:27:48 GMT -4
Post by lirette on Nov 4, 2020 11:27:48 GMT -4
For your 2nd point. Democratic voters are more COVID cautious and tend to vote more remotely. Republicans tend to vote in person on election day. Yup ... that's what CNN alluded to. But statistically I find it to be BS. If anybody in the US was actually COVID cautious they wouldn't be in the quite the mess they are in now, especially in Democratic strongholds. Is it just Republicans getting COVID ? There are COVID cautious people on both sides of the dividing line. I'm not buying the large imbalance in mail in votes when the rest of the voters are roughly split down 50-50 lines. Trump spent the last 6 months railing over and over and over how mail in votes are fraudulent despite zero historical evidence. It should be of zero surprise that his voters would then not trust that method of voting despite there being little to no evidence that there's been fraud with mail in votes. It is an extremely secure system that is used by some states at 100% and has been used by the US Military for close to 100 years. I legitimately cannot believe people still fall for this conman. He has been telegraphing this in press conferences for months. Election ballots are looked at by both a democrat and republican to be certified. The polling data always showed that more democrats voted by mail by 2 or 3 to 1 in some areas. That information was available on many different media outlets not just CNN. Fox News Polls is calling the same information based on expected mail in ballots. All independant outlets from each other. There is no conspiracy here. They are counting the votes. This is going exactly the way it was expected all along, except trump seems to have gotten a greater turnout than expected and overperformed in places like the senate. Holding the Senate will severely hinder Bidens ability to pass legislation if he wins. The polls were off in certain areas but Biden could always win with a decent polling error. Both parties are turning out record numbers. The republicans did well with the latino vote which won them Florida. Trump tried to declare himself the winner of the election while many states were still up for grabs, disturbing leaders worldwide. This is not normal. But here we are still saying "both candidates suck" while democracy hangs in the balance. I should also add, that we'd have most of these results by now, but the republicans blocked the states we are waiting for from counting ballots early (like florida does). Some of these ballots have been received were weeks but they weren't allowed to count them.
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Trump
Nov 4, 2020 13:02:44 GMT -4
Post by lirette on Nov 4, 2020 13:02:44 GMT -4
Biden looks favored, but it's closer than I thought. He could win without Penn or Georgia. The late counting of early votes skews the results. People love to vocally hate Trump but the reality of the matter is that both candidates are awful. That’s going to lead to more people not vocalizing the fact they’ll vote for Trump and the polls making it seem like Biden would win in a cake walk. This is the 2nd time the Democratic Party has had a lob ball just waiting for them to hit a home run and they haven’t. That says a lot about their candidates IMO. If they actually had someone good running in either of these elections, they knock it out of the park. This is a literal coin flip at this point, I think Biden wins but I also wouldn’t bet my house on it like many would have 24 hours ago. Biden is on pace to have the most votes in the history of the united states of any candidate. So I dont really know how you reconcile that with being a terrible candidate. The Trump campaign turned out a ton of new votes though too, there is some obvious weakness here for the democrats that they need to figure out. Personally I was never excited about him, hes obviously a very "establishment" type. He grew on me and I see him as someone who restores decency to a platform that is one of the most influential in the world. Having a politican with zero empathy is a terrifying thing. I don't see how anyone could look at Biden and not see someone with empathy who actually cares about his constituents even if you don't agree with his policies or find him inpsiring in anyway. I believe there is much more excitement in a Biden Cabinet then Biden himself. He's looking at bringing progressives and moderates together to share ideas. He'll surround himself with competent people. The Trump administration and campaign on the other hand has what, 10+ people now indicted on federal or state charges on top of pending state investigations for Tax Fraud and Sexual Assault himself? Call me partisan or whatever, its fine. You have career apolitical people in roles like doctors or scientists who are being berated and replaced with sycophants. The current covid19 management is being led by a guy who has no experience in pandemics or diseases while the doctor who helped solved the aids crisis has been sidelined, received death threats and talks of being fired. I think if Biden wins, republicans still very much could win in 2024 if they find the right candidate. Also, not sure what the guy above is ranting about, maybe 1 poster predicted a landslide but I didnt see anyone else predicting that. The polls didnt really predict a landslide either. The national poll has no impact on predicting a landslide. Also polls are not votes, they give you possible outcomes. There might be something to the fact that trump supporting republicans might not be honest with pollsters though. The state by state polls had lots of close states when it came to the battlegrounds. I'm sure many "hoped" for a landslide so it was over early, but I certainly never expected a landslide personally.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Nov 4, 2020 13:17:07 GMT -4
As usual, it's kind of weird to put together a post and try to be neutral and look at things from both sides, but because you don't fall in line and refer to one person as a liar, and a conman, and a sexual deviant, and whatever else - your post is referred to as a "rant" while their posts are to be revered.
And people wonder why new posters stop posting here. . .
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Post by Jack Bauer on Nov 4, 2020 13:27:58 GMT -4
As usual, it's kind of weird to put together a post and try to be neutral and look at things from both sides, but because you don't fall in line and refer to one person as a liar, and a conman, and a sexual deviant, and whatever else - your post is referred to as a "rant" while their posts are to be revered. And people wonder why new posters stop posting here. . . You called 4 years of lies and cover ups...drama. New posters stopped posting because it's no longer cool for people to post on message boards like it once was. Twitter, facebook, reddit are the types of places younger people go to now for that. So we're left with a pile of I would say 35+ yr old people here. But it has nothing to do with 1 poster saying your post was a rant...which it came off as on page 150-something and 4-5 paragraphs of "I want to turn TV on and be entertained" as if you're talking about a drama starring your favorite actor and not real life politics and decisions effecting hundreds of millions of people. If I had a young daughter and lived in the US I would be scared for her future if Trump won this. If she was a minority i'd seriously be looking at immigrating to another country if he won. Because if you still don't see where all this is heading after 4 years you're still caught up in it being all a big TV show broadcast to you on CNN and Fox News. There are 75yr olds in Pennsylvania voting for Trump because of his, and especially Pence's, stance on abortion. Cubans voting him in Miami due to fears of socialism that are all 100% false. In Canada we just call both health care. But in America if you let them disguise human right items as something effecting the financial well being of the nation then you win votes. Because overall the population isn't smart enough to seem to understand that the Senate and House control policy as much as any 1 President does.
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Trump
Nov 4, 2020 13:30:19 GMT -4
Post by Jack Bauer on Nov 4, 2020 13:30:19 GMT -4
I watched CNN last night and this morning. I cringe when they use the term "we" to talk about the democrat votes. When I was a kid the media was all about reporting the truth, and stayed away from opinion and bias as best they could. CNN kept saying that there is a tremendous divide in the country, and I am baffled that they don't see that they create that divide with the their slanted reporting. Its very frustrating to watch. But as I watch things change this morning, it looked like Trump was headed to surprising victory (again) last night when I went to bed around 1:30. But now its all of these mail in votes that are being counted and slowing down the process, and I get that it is a new process in this election so their will be wrinkles. Here are some questions I have that have me baffled: 1. Why are we still waiting for 7 or 8 states when all of the western states are done and have finalized results? It makes no sense to me that it is taking this long for some states, but states with larger populations finished with little delay. I know we expected delays, but I'm not understanding it. 2. CNN is saying that all of these Mail in ballots are going to be heavy on Democratic voters, and that could bring Biden back into a winning margin. Not impossible for sure. But why is it that Democratic voters wanted a mail in ballot but Republican voters did not ? Makes no sense unless the Dems have loaded the ballot box with fake mail in ballots. It seems statistically improbable when everything about this election is almost split 50-50. Most of the states still counting had huge early vote numbers and wanted to start counting early. The GOP stopped that from happening to play into Trumps "get ahead and call it a win" strategy that is hilariously failing on twitter.
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