You think Hodge is a tad biased?

[chsb]

murph said:

chsb said:

On the other topic, you omitted to mention Clendenning and Massé as top-2 liners.
So let me review with you:
Messier/Massé-Perreault-Svoboda
Clendenning-Messier(?)-?

Only 1 2nd liner missing and I have the following possibilities:
Joly
Grenache
Mailloux
Faille
Jezegou

Whoever goes up to 2nd line does not deplete the 3rd line because we are left with 4 of 3rd liners for any team in the Q.
Plus we have Critchlow,Couture,Legros,Lambke as 4th liners/backups.

Evaluating that 3rd liners as a whole will score 40 goals does not impede one of 3rd liners going up to 2nd line.
Whoever is left on 3rd line still gives us 40 goals potentila for that line.
The question remains IF any 3rd liner going to 2nd line will match Messier's or Massé's scoring on the 2nd line.
Theer is absolutely no doubt for me that any of Massé/Messier will match Bartos' potential goals scoring output....

Here's how I see you players:

1st liners: Mathieu Perrault

2nd liners: Svoboda (higher end 2nd liner), Masse and Messier

3rd liners: Clendenning, Joly, Faille, Jezegou

4th liners: Everybody else


Now, like I said, it's possible guys will develop and get bumped up. The only guy I think could turn into an impact 1st line player is Svoboda. Jordan Clendenning is a guy that I don't think will develop. He's been in the league long enough, and what you see is what you get. He's a very good 3rd line center, perhaps the best. Now matter how you slice it though, you will be at least 1 impact forward short of a contender. Halifax could have Voracek make Columbus, and they'd still be ahead of Bathurst. A lot of things will need to go right for Bathurst to be a contender, or managment will just have to believe in the team, and load up and hope for the best.

In 06-07, here are a few parallels between Halifax's 2nd line players and Titan's:
Massé(season and playoffs)= 0.78 ppg
Clendenning(both)= 0.84 ppg
Hillier(both)= 0.83 ppg
Swan(both) = 0.86 ppg
Corsi(both)= 0.65 ppg

Now if you want to bring in season 05-06 parallel between Clendenning/Hillier/Swan, I have no problem with it

Not only does Jordan shut down the opponent big lines, but he also produces at the same level as Swan and Hillier.
I have not read anything from you stating that these two from the Mooseheads did not belong to the 2nd line.

[Murph]

mikeb said:

murph said:

As it stands now, Halifax's goaltending is in exactly the same situation as Bathurst's. Each team has an inexperienced, yet talented guy with potential to blossom, who pretty much have 3 months to impress.

Not exactly.

Halifax has 2 19YO guys who are fighting to be the first string goalie which is something they never were before and neither goalie was considered a hot prospect when drafted.

Bathurst has a 17YO goalie who was ranked in the 1st round in the entry draft.

The potential between Tardif and the other 2 is somewhat different wouldn't you say?

Sure overall Tardif has much more potential and room to grow. But not for this upcoming season. That's all I care about.

[mikeb]

billy said:

mikeb said:

Not exactly.

Halifax has 2 19YO guys who are fighting to be the first string goalie which is something they never were before and neither goalie was considered a hot prospect when drafted.

Bathurst has a 17YO goalie who was ranked in the 1st round in the entry draft.

The potential between Tardif and the other 2 is somewhat different wouldn't you say?

Tardif has much more upside...but goalies in junior usually peak at 19-20, not usually 17.

I would disagree. Most goalies hit their stride at 18YO. In fact some goalies even regress a bit after stellar 18YO seasons. And average goalies are average goalies at any age.

[Captain Obvious]

porkchop said:

billy said:

Tardif has much more upside...but goalies in junior usually peak at 19-20, not usually 17.

When you are 19 and still having a hard time to make it as a backup, let alone a starter, it's about time to admit that you already peaked......which is the case with Halifax's goalies.......I wouldn't want either of their goalies as our backup.

Regardless, neither team will win a Q title with their current goaltending.

[Captain Obvious]

porkchop said:

wingman said:

What's wrong with Kennedy or Yetman as backups, if anything they would be the ideal backup. They both have been starters for the Mooseheads last season and as a backup they are reliable enough to come in and play every 5th game or so. Plus if your starter goes down for a few games, they have the experience of being a starter from last season.

Wouldn't a reliable backup be someone that could step in and you wouldn't worry about every shot taken ending up behind him?.......Maxime Joyal was a very good goalie, and most had him pegged as a backup......he was 4 times what either of Halifax's goalie are.

Halifax's 2 goalies are no worse than Legault. All are mediocre 19 year olds.

[chsb]

billy said:

porkchop said:

When you are 19 and still having a hard time to make it as a backup, let alone a starter, it's about time to admit that you already peaked......which is the case with Halifax's goalies.......I wouldn't want either of their goalies as our backup.

Regardless, neither team will win a Q title with their current goaltending.

So far so good for the Legault/Tardif tendem....

How many times did you see Legault play?

As I said...so far so good....

[Captain Obvious]

chsb said:

billy said:

Regardless, neither team will win a Q title with their current goaltending.

So far so good for the Legault/Tardif tendem....

How many times did you see Legault play?

As I said...so far so good....

What the heck is that supposed to mean? The season hasn't even started. Neither of those guysw had a great camp statistically either, you're talking out your ass again.

[SteveUL]

chsb said:

billy said:

Regardless, neither team will win a Q title with their current goaltending.

So far so good for the Legault/Tardif tendem....

How many times did you see Legault play?

As I said...so far so good....

So far so good ? Are you referring to pre-season ... I assume you are since thats all you have to go on. The Titan had a sub-0.500 record ... and gave up more goals than they scored ... and Champion played a pretty decent part early on in keeping out goals.

But its pre-season so its meaningless ... but you are the one saying it was good.

[Porkchop]

billy said:

porkchop said:

Wouldn't a reliable backup be someone that could step in and you wouldn't worry about every shot taken ending up behind him?.......Maxime Joyal was a very good goalie, and most had him pegged as a backup......he was 4 times what either of Halifax's goalie are.

Halifax's 2 goalies are no worse than Legault. All are mediocre 19 year olds.

The difference being that Legault was brought in as a backup......Kennedy is there as a starter.

[CrazyJoeDavola]

chsb said:

murph said:

Here's how I see you players:

1st liners: Mathieu Perrault

2nd liners: Svoboda (higher end 2nd liner), Masse and Messier

3rd liners: Clendenning, Joly, Faille, Jezegou

4th liners: Everybody else


Now, like I said, it's possible guys will develop and get bumped up. The only guy I think could turn into an impact 1st line player is Svoboda. Jordan Clendenning is a guy that I don't think will develop. He's been in the league long enough, and what you see is what you get. He's a very good 3rd line center, perhaps the best. Now matter how you slice it though, you will be at least 1 impact forward short of a contender. Halifax could have Voracek make Columbus, and they'd still be ahead of Bathurst. A lot of things will need to go right for Bathurst to be a contender, or managment will just have to believe in the team, and load up and hope for the best.

In 06-07, here are a few parallels between Halifax's 2nd line players and Titan's:
Massé(season and playoffs)= 0.78 ppg
Clendenning(both)= 0.84 ppg
Hillier(both)= 0.83 ppg
Swan(both) = 0.86 ppg
Corsi(both)= 0.65 ppg

Now if you want to bring in season 05-06 parallel between Clendenning/Hillier/Swan, I have no problem with it

Not only does Jordan shut down the opponent big lines, but he also produces at the same level as Swan and Hillier.
I have not read anything from you stating that these two from the Mooseheads did not belong to the 2nd line.

Analysing a combined PPG for players, on different teams, from a previous season, means basically nothing. Then you have to add in that Corsi played 3rd line (+ VD'or time), and Corsi+Hillier were 18 while Clendenning was 19 etc etc etc... plus team styles...

You cant just use PPG stats to determine who belongs where. Hillier and Swan both scored more than 30 goals, and in Hilliers case moreso than Swan's, he had a bad year as he started the season awful. Clendenning had a good playoff which obviously helps his stats since you combine them. But last year Titan fans were growing pretty impatient with the lack of offense coming from him and his second line.

[chsb]

billy said:

chsb said:

So far so good for the Legault/Tardif tendem....

How many times did you see Legault play?

As I said...so far so good....

What the heck is that supposed to mean? The season hasn't even started. Neither of those guysw had a great camp statistically either, you're talking out your ass again.

I am talking about what I saw so far from our goaltending tandem.

[IslandersHKY]

chsb said:

billy said:

Regardless, neither team will win a Q title with their current goaltending.

So far so good for the Legault/Tardif tendem....

How many times did you see Legault play?

As I said...so far so good....

What are you basing that on?

After preseason Tardif's/Legault's combined record was 3-3 (0.500 which isn't the sign of Top Goaltending)

As well among preseason goalies who played in more than one game Tardif's GAA ranked around 17th overall and Legault's around 29th overall.

Obviously only preseason which is why I'm not knocking them, I'm must wondering where you have seen indications that the Titan's goaltending will be above average because so far the numbers certainly don't show it.

Doesn't mean that the Titan aren't a good team but I can't understand what you are basing your "So far so good" statement on.

[Krang7]

I bet their save percentage in practice and intra-squads was phenomenal though. C'mon people, keep up to the CHSB logic...

[SteveUL]

porkchop said:

billy said:

Halifax's 2 goalies are no worse than Legault. All are mediocre 19 year olds.

The difference being that Legault was brought in as a backup......Kennedy is there as a starter.

Really ? I've always felt Kennedy was the backup ... and he is only there until they figure out which 20 YO goaltender they will trade for. Yetman is the starter for now since he was their man in the playoffs last year.

I expect that Legault will share the load with Tardif ... probably 50/50 split in starts ... depends on how Francoeur likes to run it though. Tardif needs at least half the starts (35) ... but 50 is probably too many ... depends on who is hot and what kind of race you find your team in.

[chsb]

crazyjoedevola said:

chsb said:

In 06-07, here are a few parallels between Halifax's 2nd line players and Titan's:
Massé(season and playoffs)= 0.78 ppg
Clendenning(both)= 0.84 ppg
Hillier(both)= 0.83 ppg
Swan(both) = 0.86 ppg
Corsi(both)= 0.65 ppg

Now if you want to bring in season 05-06 parallel between Clendenning/Hillier/Swan, I have no problem with it

Not only does Jordan shut down the opponent big lines, but he also produces at the same level as Swan and Hillier.
I have not read anything from you stating that these two from the Mooseheads did not belong to the 2nd line.

Analysing a combined PPG for players, on different teams, from a previous season, means basically nothing. Then you have to add in that Corsi played 3rd line (+ VD'or time), and Corsi+Hillier were 18 while Clendenning was 19 etc etc etc... plus team styles...

You cant just use PPG stats to determine who belongs where. Hillier and Swan both scored more than 30 goals, and in Hilliers case moreso than Swan's, he had a bad year as he started the season awful. Clendenning had a good playoff which obviously helps his stats since you combine them. But last year Titan fans were growing pretty impatient with the lack of offense coming from him and his second line.

It is OK for you to say that Hillier has na "off year" but yet decline to acknowledge about Celdenning having an "off year" and that he rebounded in the playoffs.
Comparing Clendenning to Hillier or Swan makes more sense than saying that Jordan does not belong on a 2nd line while the Moose players are belonging there.

Jordan has more grit, more character than the two combined.