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Post by sec19fan on Dec 19, 2021 9:58:04 GMT -4
Toronto Maple Leafs head coach Sheldon Keefe has been added to the NHL's COVID-19 protocol. The Leafs also placed defencemen TJ Brodie and Travis Dermott, goalie Jack Campbell and assistant coach Spencer Carbery on the protocol list Saturday.
Toronto had two games postponed earlier in the day, including Saturday's scheduled matchup with the Canucks in Vancouver. A game against the Kraken in Seattle on Sunday was also pushed back indefinitely.
Four Leafs players were put on the COVID list Friday, including John Tavares, Alex Kerfoot, Jason Spezza and Wayne Simmonds.
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Post by sec19fan on Jan 1, 2022 8:24:52 GMT -4
The Ontario government limited capacity at large indoor venues to 1,000 people on Thursday. Major League Sports and Entertainment, which owns the Maple Leafs and the NBA's Toronto Raptors, has said its games will be held without fans while that restriction is in place.
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Post by sec19fan on Jan 2, 2022 10:44:04 GMT -4
Watched part of the Leafs game last night late in the 3rd. Arena completely empty. Then I saw the start of the Vancouver game in Seattle. Complete opposite - rink is almost full (17,151 in attendance) and hardly a mask to be seen. It's like were living in 2 completely different worlds...
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Post by Jack Bauer on Jan 4, 2022 9:39:37 GMT -4
Too bad the Leafs are doing well do there's nothing for people to come in and tell us who they can trade again to fix their depth issues.
It is quite comical the level of quiet that exists when they do well.
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Post by Captain Obvious on Jan 4, 2022 9:56:21 GMT -4
Too bad the Leafs are doing well do there's nothing for people to come in and tell us who they can trade again to fix their depth issues. It is quite comical the level of quiet that exists when they do well. Their issue has not been with regular season success, they have a team that can't or won't play playoff style hockey. Winning a bunch of regular season games won't prove that wrong, winning 2-3 playoff rounds would...
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Post by Jack Bauer on Jan 4, 2022 10:15:13 GMT -4
Too bad the Leafs are doing well do there's nothing for people to come in and tell us who they can trade again to fix their depth issues. It is quite comical the level of quiet that exists when they do well. Their issue has not been with regular season success, they have a team that can't or won't play playoff style hockey. Winning a bunch of regular season games won't prove that wrong, winning 2-3 playoff rounds would... Hard to win playoff rounds in January. Winning regular season games proves you're doing something right. We can dismiss regular season hockey all we want but you cant win any playoff games without being a pretty good team during the season. Didnt Montreal fans just completely dismiss 3 rounds of playoff victories by firing the guy who built that team? How important IS playoff success when its ignored before Christmas of the following season? Sometimes we spend too much time over thinking what is actual success at this level. Was Bergevin that unsuccessful by taking his team to the final and losing his top players for nothing?
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Post by Captain Obvious on Jan 4, 2022 10:38:16 GMT -4
Their issue has not been with regular season success, they have a team that can't or won't play playoff style hockey. Winning a bunch of regular season games won't prove that wrong, winning 2-3 playoff rounds would... Hard to win playoff rounds in January. Winning regular season games proves you're doing something right. We can dismiss regular season hockey all we want but you cant win any playoff games without being a pretty good team during the season. Didnt Montreal fans just completely dismiss 3 rounds of playoff victories by firing the guy who built that team? How important IS playoff success when its ignored before Christmas of the following season? Sometimes we spend too much time over thinking what is actual success at this level. Was Bergevin that unsuccessful by taking his team to the final and losing his top players for nothing? I'm not suggesting they win playoff games in January, just saying that this is how the TML season will be judged. If they lose in the 1st round again, heads will roll. In terms of the Habs, Bergevin refused an extension in the summer, so Molson didn't want a lame duck GM with the team struggling.
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Post by Jack Bauer on Jan 4, 2022 10:49:16 GMT -4
Hard to win playoff rounds in January. Winning regular season games proves you're doing something right. We can dismiss regular season hockey all we want but you cant win any playoff games without being a pretty good team during the season. Didnt Montreal fans just completely dismiss 3 rounds of playoff victories by firing the guy who built that team? How important IS playoff success when its ignored before Christmas of the following season? Sometimes we spend too much time over thinking what is actual success at this level. Was Bergevin that unsuccessful by taking his team to the final and losing his top players for nothing? I'm not suggesting they win playoff games in January, just saying that this is how the TML season will be judged. If they lose in the 1st round again, heads will roll. In terms of the Habs, Bergevin refused an extension in the summer, so Molson didn't want a lame duck GM with the team struggling. It depends. Could end up having a 100+ point season and not even having home ice in round 1. Florida could easily win the division by 1 or 2 points over a TML or TB. Covid is about to wreak havoc with an insane 2nd half schedule. If you lose to Tampa in 7 you're blowing it up? Its never as simple as win or else in pro sports. How you win or lose absolutely matters.
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Post by Captain Obvious on Jan 4, 2022 11:23:37 GMT -4
I'm not suggesting they win playoff games in January, just saying that this is how the TML season will be judged. If they lose in the 1st round again, heads will roll. In terms of the Habs, Bergevin refused an extension in the summer, so Molson didn't want a lame duck GM with the team struggling. It depends. Could end up having a 100+ point season and not even having home ice in round 1. Florida could easily win the division by 1 or 2 points over a TML or TB. Covid is about to wreak havoc with an insane 2nd half schedule. If you lose to Tampa in 7 you're blowing it up? Its never as simple as win or else in pro sports. How you win or lose absolutely matters. At some point not getting out of the 1st round matters. When you have the same group constantly falling short, team make changes. If you do well every year and lose in round 1 one year it's not a killer but after 18 years with nothing to show, fans and ownership get impatient.
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Post by Jack Bauer on Jan 4, 2022 11:37:04 GMT -4
It depends. Could end up having a 100+ point season and not even having home ice in round 1. Florida could easily win the division by 1 or 2 points over a TML or TB. Covid is about to wreak havoc with an insane 2nd half schedule. If you lose to Tampa in 7 you're blowing it up? Its never as simple as win or else in pro sports. How you win or lose absolutely matters. At some point not getting out of the 1st round matters. When you have the same group constantly falling short, team make changes. If you do well every year and lose in round 1 one year it's not a killer but after 18 years with nothing to show, fans and ownership get impatient. I agree. At some point it matters. Are we at that point? Everyone is signed into next year for the most part so I would say why do you blow it up now? How many times did Washington bring back the same core before winning? Its not 18 years for this group lol that drought has nothing to do with this. None of this core was responsible for anything prior to 2016...that was 6 years ago. 6 years ago Mitch Marner was in London. Nylander was a Marlie. Matthews was in Switzerland. Jack Campbell was in the ECHL. Its been 5 playoff exits. The first 2 with the core being 19/20 years old. So we blow it up when they're all 23/24? I'll take my chances with that core for the next 2-3 years easily. None of them are not getting better. We kept hearing we'd get worse as the depth left. Hasnt happened yet, though. But eventually a broken clock will be right.
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Post by Captain Obvious on Jan 4, 2022 12:00:01 GMT -4
At some point not getting out of the 1st round matters. When you have the same group constantly falling short, team make changes. If you do well every year and lose in round 1 one year it's not a killer but after 18 years with nothing to show, fans and ownership get impatient. I agree. At some point it matters. Are we at that point? Everyone is signed into next year for the most part so I would say why do you blow it up now? How many times did Washington bring back the same core before winning? Its not 18 years for this group lol that drought has nothing to do with this. None of this core was responsible for anything prior to 2016...that was 6 years ago. 6 years ago Mitch Marner was in London. Nylander was a Marlie. Matthews was in Switzerland. Jack Campbell was in the ECHL. Its been 5 playoff exits. The first 2 with the core being 19/20 years old. So we blow it up when they're all 23/24? I'll take my chances with that core for the next 2-3 years easily. None of them are not getting better. We kept hearing we'd get worse as the depth left. Hasnt happened yet, though. But eventually a broken clock will be right. Washington made major changes before winning a cup, they fired Boudreau and eventually hired Trottz who helped them win a cup. As I said earlier, if they lose in round 1 again, heads will role, key players, coaches and Gm could all move.
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Post by Jack Bauer on Jan 5, 2022 10:01:50 GMT -4
I agree. At some point it matters. Are we at that point? Everyone is signed into next year for the most part so I would say why do you blow it up now? How many times did Washington bring back the same core before winning? Its not 18 years for this group lol that drought has nothing to do with this. None of this core was responsible for anything prior to 2016...that was 6 years ago. 6 years ago Mitch Marner was in London. Nylander was a Marlie. Matthews was in Switzerland. Jack Campbell was in the ECHL. Its been 5 playoff exits. The first 2 with the core being 19/20 years old. So we blow it up when they're all 23/24? I'll take my chances with that core for the next 2-3 years easily. None of them are not getting better. We kept hearing we'd get worse as the depth left. Hasnt happened yet, though. But eventually a broken clock will be right. Washington made major changes before winning a cup, they fired Boudreau and eventually hired Trottz who helped them win a cup. As I said earlier, if they lose in round 1 again, heads will role, key players, coaches and Gm could all move. Yeah Toronto has just kept rolling out the same group for 5 years. Great chat as usual.
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Post by yesisaiditfirst on Jan 5, 2022 11:14:19 GMT -4
I agree. At some point it matters. Are we at that point? Everyone is signed into next year for the most part so I would say why do you blow it up now? How many times did Washington bring back the same core before winning? Its not 18 years for this group lol that drought has nothing to do with this. None of this core was responsible for anything prior to 2016...that was 6 years ago. 6 years ago Mitch Marner was in London. Nylander was a Marlie. Matthews was in Switzerland. Jack Campbell was in the ECHL. Its been 5 playoff exits. The first 2 with the core being 19/20 years old. So we blow it up when they're all 23/24? I'll take my chances with that core for the next 2-3 years easily. None of them are not getting better. We kept hearing we'd get worse as the depth left. Hasnt happened yet, though. But eventually a broken clock will be right. Washington made major changes before winning a cup, they fired Boudreau and eventually hired Trottz who helped them win a cup. As I said earlier, if they lose in round 1 again, heads will role, key players, coaches and Gm could all move. So Boudreau was a rookie NHL coach in 2008 when hired mid-season. He was fired in 2012 after a surprise playoff appearance year 1, Solid year 2 with loss to defending Eastern Conf Champs in round 2, Year 3 choke after Presidents cup, year 4 decent year total defense style change and ensuing loss in round 2 sweep....then fired in year 5 ---- Dale Hunter hired to finish season knocked off defending Champs in round 1 (Washington had to use 3rd string goalie -Holtby - and was big underdog) lost in 7 to Rangers in round 2... Then they hired Adam Oates...another rookie. Big mistake- even missed playoffs. Ended up costing GM his job. Then they hired Brian MacLellan as GM and it changed the culture first. Yes Trotz came too but until Brooks Orpik and Matt Niskanen arrived that free agency with the new GM nothing was going to change. The new GM was immediately changing culture....and eventually after 3 really good seasons not winning but losing to NYR & PIT they became able to win. So every organization is different. The big question is what is the culture like?? Is the current coach and GM your George McPhee/ Boudreau or your MacLellan/Trotz My guess if there is a bad transition yet to come.
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Post by Jack Bauer on Jan 5, 2022 11:23:10 GMT -4
Washington made major changes before winning a cup, they fired Boudreau and eventually hired Trottz who helped them win a cup. As I said earlier, if they lose in round 1 again, heads will role, key players, coaches and Gm could all move. So Boudreau was a rookie NHL coach in 2008 when hired mid-season. He was fired in 2012 after a surprise playoff appearance year 1, Solid year 2 with loss to defending Eastern Conf Champs in round 2, Year 3 choke after Presidents cup, year 4 decent year total defense style change and ensuing loss in round 2 sweep....then fired in year 5 ---- Dale Hunter hired to finish season knocked off defending Champs in round 1 (Washington had to use 3rd string goalie -Holtby - and was big underdog) lost in 7 to Rangers in round 2... Then they hired Adam Oates...another rookie. Big mistake- even missed playoffs. Ended up costing GM his job. Then they hired Brian MacLellan as GM and it changed the culture first. Yes Trotz came too but until Brooks Orpik and Matt Niskanen arrived that free agency with the new GM nothing was going to change. The new GM was immediately changing culture....and eventually after 3 really good seasons not winning but losing to NYR & PIT they became able to win. So every organization is different. The big question is what is the culture like?? Is the current coach and GM your George McPhee/ Boudreau or your MacLellan/Trotz My guess if there is a bad transition yet to come. And there's been a huge change in how the developing talent plays under Keefe vs how it did under Babcock. Even while all the depth was stripped away as ELC's became superstar contracts. If there is a regression...like say they implode and miss the playoffs. Or get swept. Yep - big change needed. If they grind it out...finish 1 point behind 1st...play Tampa and lose a game 7? I dont really change a thing. There would be no shame in losing to a great team in a close series. The Leafs have shown some resiliency over the playoff years just not enough to get over the hump but we're talking 19/20/21yr old stars who are still 3-5 years from peaking. But point is you need to analyze the situation after the fact. Rushing to declare failure by saying its X or blow it up is way too short sighted. The process on the way to losing (or not) absolutely matters.
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Post by Captain Obvious on Jan 5, 2022 11:27:43 GMT -4
So Boudreau was a rookie NHL coach in 2008 when hired mid-season. He was fired in 2012 after a surprise playoff appearance year 1, Solid year 2 with loss to defending Eastern Conf Champs in round 2, Year 3 choke after Presidents cup, year 4 decent year total defense style change and ensuing loss in round 2 sweep....then fired in year 5 ---- Dale Hunter hired to finish season knocked off defending Champs in round 1 (Washington had to use 3rd string goalie -Holtby - and was big underdog) lost in 7 to Rangers in round 2... Then they hired Adam Oates...another rookie. Big mistake- even missed playoffs. Ended up costing GM his job. Then they hired Brian MacLellan as GM and it changed the culture first. Yes Trotz came too but until Brooks Orpik and Matt Niskanen arrived that free agency with the new GM nothing was going to change. The new GM was immediately changing culture....and eventually after 3 really good seasons not winning but losing to NYR & PIT they became able to win. So every organization is different. The big question is what is the culture like?? Is the current coach and GM your George McPhee/ Boudreau or your MacLellan/Trotz My guess if there is a bad transition yet to come. And there's been a huge change in how the developing talent plays under Keefe vs how it did under Babcock. Even while all the depth was stripped away as ELC's became superstar contracts. If there is a regression...like say they implode and miss the playoffs. Or get swept. Yep - big change needed. If they grind it out...finish 1 point behind 1st...play Tampa and lose a game 7? I dont really change a thing. There would be no shame in losing to a great team in a close series. The Leafs have shown some resiliency over the playoff years just not enough to get over the hump but we're talking 19/20/21yr old stars who are still 3-5 years from peaking. But point is you need to analyze the situation after the fact. Rushing to declare failure by saying its X or blow it up is way too short sighted. The process on the way to losing (or not) absolutely matters. I think they don't get out of round 1, 7 games or not, a major piece is getting traded and a coach or GM is gone.
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