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Post by Jack Bauer on Nov 3, 2023 13:48:15 GMT -4
I see it as Marchand going for the puck and due to the angle his stick going forward hits Liljegrens left leg because as both were slowing down there was nowhere else for Marchands stick to go at that point because they were already locked up. But still...how many times are people needing to watch it to determine the intent? And the intent still isnt a trying to injure the other guy its a positioning thing where the momentum causes awkward movements into the boards. I'm not even arguing it wasnt a penalty. I thought it was. This intentional attempt to injure...I dont think its that obvious. And why expecting a big response in that moment in that game just seems silly to me. Put yourself short handed to the best team in hockey to prove the refs missed a call doesnt seem that great to me. So no response at all ? C'mon I know you don't mean that ? It's a game in October not in the final 12 games down the stretch ? It makes them look weak whether it's 1975 or 2023 . The closest player to anything there was Mark Giordano....Yes hal...no response. Giordano sees that and jumps Marchand and gets 2+5+10. We start the 2nd short handed. We're down to 4 D for the entire period against the best team in the league and in their rink. The hilarious part now has to be said: After doing nothing Toronto fell down 2-0. Then somehow miraculously after showing no physical will tied the game and ended up in a shootout. These are 2 high end teams where little things decide games. To argue for a response there is also arguing for giving points away. Its early in the season but the points in these games mean the exact same. If someone responds there the overall narrative that they're weak doesnt change. Guys like Matthews, Tavares, Marner and Nylander are weak using that measuring stick. Lets face it a Reaves gooning someone later on or Giordano doing it in that moment does not change anything about how the team is viewed and how they play. Hell using that 1975 measuring stick every single team in that league is soft. Are you watching 2023 hockey or 1975 hockey? In every game im watching in 2023 that stuff isnt getting retaliated against in most cases. In 1975 it would have been in every case.
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Post by scotiahockey on Nov 3, 2023 14:11:51 GMT -4
Hasn't underachieving sort of been the theme of Bertuzzi's career, other than relatively brief stretches when he figures out how to put it together? Yes it has but going to Boston last year lit a fire under him. If not producing I at least expecting a little more of a physical/on the edge player. But he's mostly been quiet. That’s the problem though, he isn’t a physical player. Never has been. He’s basically a repackaged Bunting. He probably gives you 20-25 and 50ish points with maybe a spike if something clicks.
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Post by Jack Bauer on Nov 3, 2023 14:18:39 GMT -4
Yes it has but going to Boston last year lit a fire under him. If not producing I at least expecting a little more of a physical/on the edge player. But he's mostly been quiet. That’s the problem though, he isn’t a physical player. Never has been. He’s basically a repackaged Bunting. He probably gives you 20-25 and 50ish points with maybe a spike if something clicks. I'd take that. He's nowhere near it right now. Nothing is clicking. Message sent to him last night being moved around so maybe that gets him going. The only positive with some of these additions so far is term.
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Post by scotiahockey on Nov 3, 2023 14:34:55 GMT -4
is enough time passed to ask Leaf fans their thoughts on the off season additions now? Domi, Bertuzzi, Klingberg and Reaves I'd suggest none of them are replacing anything they lost Reaves was a terrible signing from day 1, never made sense, still doesn’t make sense. I’ll never get understand that signing because it was dumb from the minute they signed him. Their biggest issue in the playoffs was scoring goals, so they sign a guy who can’t shoot a puck into the ocean. Makes sense. Klingberg is terrible defensively, he was terrible defensively when they signed him and he’s another guy who just never made sense from the get go. If he’s your #6 D, running a PP then sure but at this stage of his career he’s nothing more. It shouldn’t have taken 10 games to figure that out, he’s been that way for a few seasons. I think their D needed a completely different style of player than Klingberg. Bertuzzi is a Bunting replacement, they’re the same player. He’s probably better served as a 2nd/3rd line winger, who can play up and down a lineup. There’s this idea that he’s physical but he’s not, he’s an oft-injured winger who is inconsistent. It’s a 1 year, which gives them added flexibility compared to Bunting.. the early returns aren’t great but my guess is it comes out as a wash. Domi is what he is, a guy who produces on bad teams when he gets lots of favourable minutes but when he’s lower in a lineup, is very quiet. Between the cap hit and the role he was expected to fill, I think he’s fine even if the production hasn’t been there yet. People can not like what Dubas did but I think Treliving has done a terrible job so far (like has has in his career) and done nothing to make me think that was the right move. He’s sunk 3.75 million into 2 black holes offensively (on term) in Kampf and Reaves, you trade Lafferty to keep up Minten (to then do what everyone knew would happen anyways) and even though Lafferty is no star, I think he’s proven he’s a more then capable NHLer. The bottom of the lineup, really needed to find a way to produce some secondary scoring because that’s what good teams get in the playoffs but these moves don’t ever make you think that’s what’s going to happen.
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Post by hal on Nov 3, 2023 16:34:17 GMT -4
The Boys on Overdrive are just ripping the Leafs . A chance to show your Fans that you really care and .........nothing . All 3 of them are so disappointed with what unfolded . The DNA is what it is and as long as the core at the top turn a blind eye, the rest will follow .
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Post by Score on Nov 3, 2023 18:29:55 GMT -4
I'm enjoying watching the Kypper and Bourne show.
They also have been ripping the Leafs......especially Bertuzzi
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Post by hal on Nov 3, 2023 19:08:43 GMT -4
Kypreos is really pissed at the Leafs .
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Post by Captain Obvious on Nov 4, 2023 8:22:31 GMT -4
is enough time passed to ask Leaf fans their thoughts on the off season additions now? Domi, Bertuzzi, Klingberg and Reaves I'd suggest none of them are replacing anything they lost Reaves was a terrible signing from day 1, never made sense, still doesn’t make sense. I’ll never get understand that signing because it was dumb from the minute they signed him. Their biggest issue in the playoffs was scoring goals, so they sign a guy who can’t shoot a puck into the ocean. Makes sense. Klingberg is terrible defensively, he was terrible defensively when they signed him and he’s another guy who just never made sense from the get go. If he’s your #6 D, running a PP then sure but at this stage of his career he’s nothing more. It shouldn’t have taken 10 games to figure that out, he’s been that way for a few seasons. I think their D needed a completely different style of player than Klingberg. Bertuzzi is a Bunting replacement, they’re the same player. He’s probably better served as a 2nd/3rd line winger, who can play up and down a lineup. There’s this idea that he’s physical but he’s not, he’s an oft-injured winger who is inconsistent. It’s a 1 year, which gives them added flexibility compared to Bunting.. the early returns aren’t great but my guess is it comes out as a wash. Domi is what he is, a guy who produces on bad teams when he gets lots of favourable minutes but when he’s lower in a lineup, is very quiet. Between the cap hit and the role he was expected to fill, I think he’s fine even if the production hasn’t been there yet. People can not like what Dubas did but I think Treliving has done a terrible job so far (like has has in his career) and done nothing to make me think that was the right move. He’s sunk 3.75 million into 2 black holes offensively (on term) in Kampf and Reaves, you trade Lafferty to keep up Minten (to then do what everyone knew would happen anyways) and even though Lafferty is no star, I think he’s proven he’s a more then capable NHLer. The bottom of the lineup, really needed to find a way to produce some secondary scoring because that’s what good teams get in the playoffs but these moves don’t ever make you think that’s what’s going to happen. I think adding reeves could have worked, but giving him multiple years with his role and age was dumb IMO
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Post by jimmy on Nov 4, 2023 8:58:56 GMT -4
Reaves was a terrible signing from day 1, never made sense, still doesn’t make sense. I’ll never get understand that signing because it was dumb from the minute they signed him. Their biggest issue in the playoffs was scoring goals, so they sign a guy who can’t shoot a puck into the ocean. Makes sense. Klingberg is terrible defensively, he was terrible defensively when they signed him and he’s another guy who just never made sense from the get go. If he’s your #6 D, running a PP then sure but at this stage of his career he’s nothing more. It shouldn’t have taken 10 games to figure that out, he’s been that way for a few seasons. I think their D needed a completely different style of player than Klingberg. Bertuzzi is a Bunting replacement, they’re the same player. He’s probably better served as a 2nd/3rd line winger, who can play up and down a lineup. There’s this idea that he’s physical but he’s not, he’s an oft-injured winger who is inconsistent. It’s a 1 year, which gives them added flexibility compared to Bunting.. the early returns aren’t great but my guess is it comes out as a wash. Domi is what he is, a guy who produces on bad teams when he gets lots of favourable minutes but when he’s lower in a lineup, is very quiet. Between the cap hit and the role he was expected to fill, I think he’s fine even if the production hasn’t been there yet. People can not like what Dubas did but I think Treliving has done a terrible job so far (like has has in his career) and done nothing to make me think that was the right move. He’s sunk 3.75 million into 2 black holes offensively (on term) in Kampf and Reaves, you trade Lafferty to keep up Minten (to then do what everyone knew would happen anyways) and even though Lafferty is no star, I think he’s proven he’s a more then capable NHLer. The bottom of the lineup, really needed to find a way to produce some secondary scoring because that’s what good teams get in the playoffs but these moves don’t ever make you think that’s what’s going to happen. I think adding reeves could have worked, but giving him multiple years with his role and age was dumb IMO He serves a role, albeit limited. At $1.3 million per year, likely pricey by a few hundred thousand, but a minor overpay in the grand scheme of things. As for the term, it is not ideal, and removes some flexibility, but so long as he can do what he does now for two more seasons, it will be the least of the Leaf’s worries.
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Post by Jack Bauer on Nov 6, 2023 12:59:34 GMT -4
So all day Saturday we hear the fallout.
Keefe: We should have reacted differently.
Tavares: addressed in the room, need to do better
Reaves: addressed in the room, next time will be different
Come out Saturday and play with some extra emotion for about 2 shifts before it went back to normal.
If Keefe wanted them to react differently why didn't he have them do that? Does he not control the ice time of players like Reaves?
Was not playing Reaves a shot at Treliving? A shot at Reaves? Realizing you can't play a goon against Boston and expect to keep up?
Ultimately Brendan Shanahan signed off on the blueprint that was 100% skill and analytics and 0% intangibles. So when these not so blatant plays happen...the organizational philosophy since 2014 has been to be the team turning the cheek and waiting for the power play.
I'm more pissed at the joke vs Buffalo then the, imo, media ignited reaction to the Boston game that they ultimately battled back in to lose in a shootout.
But this whole "we're going to play different next time X happens" is a joke. They're not. They'd need wholesale core changes to be that team.
So either double down on what you are, and win those 6-4 games, or find a new identity.
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Post by Score on Nov 6, 2023 13:45:47 GMT -4
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Post by Score on Nov 6, 2023 23:09:49 GMT -4
Is Woll good enough for a Stanley Cup Run......as i think it's obvious that Samsonov is not.
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Post by hal on Nov 7, 2023 6:56:06 GMT -4
Quite the Comeback , didn't quit .......just saying
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Post by Jack Bauer on Nov 7, 2023 13:24:30 GMT -4
Quite the Comeback , didn't quit .......just saying They've never been the quitting type. They're not gritty or going to scare anyone. But they're never out of a game. The issue is people still view not playing tough as not wanting it enough. They're not the same thing.
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Post by Captain Obvious on Nov 7, 2023 15:18:34 GMT -4
Quite the Comeback , didn't quit .......just saying They've never been the quitting type. They're not gritty or going to scare anyone. But they're never out of a game. The issue is people still view not playing tough as not wanting it enough. They're not the same thing. I didn't see the game, but a big come back with Vasilevskiy out and with him there is not the same. Though he could have an off night.
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