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Post by sharrow on Jan 27, 2010 21:48:28 GMT -4
Based on Russell's to date performance, I don't see him paying what LaLa's feel it will take so I guess he will just take his chances with the pics we currently have and when you look at Ciampini's scoring stats and you deduct his quick start you might deduct that he played against some weak teams at the beginning of the season and he became pretty average since then so his draft position could change dramically when the final list is available.
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Post by MikeC on Jan 27, 2010 21:48:40 GMT -4
In 2008 I wouldnt have minded dealing down from 6 to 10, or 6 to 13...but this season it seems as though getting that top 5 pick will be at a premium. That's what I was wondering. I think Halifax needs to go for a forward with their top pick, so if the 2 dmen ISS have as 1-2 were to pull ahead even further, would Halifax think about trading the #1 pick (should they win the lottery)? Halifax doesn't need any extra picks, but if they were able to get a 1st back and a decent player, along the lines of Desjardins or Gelinas, I wonder if they would do it.
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Post by lalalaprise on Jan 28, 2010 9:17:17 GMT -4
In 2008 I wouldnt have minded dealing down from 6 to 10, or 6 to 13...but this season it seems as though getting that top 5 pick will be at a premium. That's what I was wondering. I think Halifax needs to go for a forward with their top pick, so if the 2 dmen ISS have as 1-2 were to pull ahead even further, would Halifax think about trading the #1 pick (should they win the lottery)? Halifax doesn't need any extra picks, but if they were able to get a 1st back and a decent player, along the lines of Desjardins or Gelinas, I wonder if they would do it. Im almost always a fan of dealing down...usually when you trade up you end up paying too much, plus 2nd rd picks are turning into impact players at a rate similar to 1st rd picks (unless we are talking top 5 picks). Halifax doesnt need extra picks but it wouldnt hurt to add 3-4 high picks in 2011 and use those as trade chips during the next season. Draft Picks are gold during trade time. This year seems a bit weak on defensemen in the top 10 so even though i dont think Fraser is a 1st overall talent, perhaps a team would look at him 1st overall becaue there arent a lot of defensemen. Could be a good situation for Halifax as its obvious we need an impact scorer and there are 3-4 available early. I wouldnt mind if Halifax traded all the way down to 6 or 7...they could still get Andrew Ryan from Notre Dame Hounds at that spot and pick up extra picks, or if Burke were to fall. I guess its kind of early to be talking about the possibilities in detail, but trading down usually pays off.
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Post by howitzer on Jan 28, 2010 9:55:39 GMT -4
I wouldn't want to see us trade out of the top 5. Unless they know Burke or Ciampini will be available at 6-7 (unlikely), then I don't think it would be a good idea to move out of that top 5. Not that there wouldn't be any good players past pick 5, I just find the first drop off of talent occurs when you move out of that top 5. I like the idea of taking advantage of a desperate team haha. If someone really wants Fraser #1 or whoever, then we should be all ears. The optics of trading a #1 pick might not sit with some people, but a smart GM can really benefit from teams looking to move up.
If we use the rankings Wuest had in his article, it still looks like Ciampini and Burke would be up there for Halifax. We're not going to take a defencemen with our top pick, so that eliminates Fraser and Poulin. So that leaves Ciampini, Burke and Gamelin. If Gamelin is more of a playermaker, passer, then I don't think he's what we need. We need guys to put the puck in the net, not a set-up guy. So then that leaves Ciampini and Burke. From all accounts Burke doesn't have too many weaknesses in his game. Plus he's a homegrown product playing in our backyard. Kind of hard to not see him as being the guy right now. Still time for these rankings to change though.
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Post by Gman on Jan 28, 2010 13:21:08 GMT -4
Forget trading down. Bobby Smith is obsessed with the first overall pick. He was soooooo pissed when we had a chance at it last year, but it was traded. If he has the top pick, expect him to market the shit out of it.
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Post by lalalaprise on Jan 28, 2010 13:31:32 GMT -4
Forget trading down. Bobby Smith is obsessed with the first overall pick. He was soooooo pissed when we had a chance at it last year, but it was traded. If he has the top pick, expect him to market the shit out of it. He ok'ed the deal to trade the 1st rd pick, so yeah i understand he was pissed but it was partially his doing. I think Whether Halifax markets that they just selected a local guy 1st overall or that they traded down to 5...i dont think its going to bring more fans into the building. Just my opinion.
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Post by Gman on Jan 28, 2010 13:45:06 GMT -4
Forget trading down. Bobby Smith is obsessed with the first overall pick. He was soooooo pissed when we had a chance at it last year, but it was traded. If he has the top pick, expect him to market the shit out of it. He ok'ed the deal to trade the 1st rd pick, so yeah i understand he was pissed but it was partially his doing. I think Whether Halifax markets that they just selected a local guy 1st overall or that they traded down to 5...i dont think its going to bring more fans into the building. Just my opinion. When he ok'ed the deal, he wasn't expecting his team to be in the basement the following year (bottom 1/4 yes, but dead last? No) You could tell by his interviews that he was pissed that the team was doing so poorly, and they don't even have 1st pick overall to show for it. At least this year he has that pick to show for it. You are right though, either by trading it or keeping it, at least it has value beyond a failed Marchand experiment.
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Post by lalalaprise on Jan 28, 2010 19:35:24 GMT -4
A sags fan just posted this on radoter...
CHI had the 6th overall pick in 2007 they ended up trading it to Halifax and they recieved 12th overall, 53rd overll and 79th overall..with those 3 picks they took Deschamps, Lagace and Rousseau....
Of course this isnt typical but its funny and shocking to look at what they received by dealing those 3 this trade period...this is what they received by trading the 6th overall pick in 2007:
1st rd pick (MON) 2011 (Likely going back to MON for Jodoin) 1st rd pick (CAP) 2010 1st rd pick (LEW) 2010 2nd rd pick (SHA) 2011 2nd rd pick 2012 (Conditional if Lagace plays as a 20) 4th pick (LEW) 2010 5th pick (MTL) 2010 Levasseur, 17 Barriault, 17 Gelinas, 18
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Post by howitzer on Jan 28, 2010 19:53:38 GMT -4
A sags fan just posted this on radoter... CHI had the 6th overall pick in 2007 they ended up trading it to Halifax and they recieved 12th overall, 53rd overll and 79th overall..with those 3 picks they took Deschamps, Lagace and Rousseau.... Of course this isnt typical but its funny and shocking to look at what they received by dealing those 3 this trade period...this is what they received by trading the 6th overall pick in 2007: 1st rd pick (MON) 2011 (Likely going back to MON for Jodoin) 1st rd pick (CAP) 2010 1st rd pick (LEW) 2010 2nd rd pick (SHA) 2011 2nd rd pick 2012 (Conditional if Lagace plays as a 20) 4th pick (LEW) 2010 5th pick (MTL) 2010 Levasseur, 17 Barriault, 17 Gelinas, 18 Thats some bang for your buck right there. Wow, very interesting. Agreed that's not typical, but funny how things play out over the course of a few years. It would be interesting to follow other deals over the years and how they worked out for teams. People always want to judge a trade the day after it's made, declaring winners and losers, but it's not until a few years later (in some instances) where a real winner can be declared. Guess this goes down as one of Marcel's bad trades huh?? haha. Making it even worse is that 6th pick turned into David Gilbert, who along with a boatload of picks went to get Marchand.....ouch.
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Post by crash on Jan 28, 2010 20:16:52 GMT -4
A sags fan just posted this on radoter... CHI had the 6th overall pick in 2007 they ended up trading it to Halifax and they recieved 12th overall, 53rd overll and 79th overall..with those 3 picks they took Deschamps, Lagace and Rousseau.... Of course this isnt typical but its funny and shocking to look at what they received by dealing those 3 this trade period...this is what they received by trading the 6th overall pick in 2007: 1st rd pick (MON) 2011 (Likely going back to MON for Jodoin) 1st rd pick (CAP) 2010 1st rd pick (LEW) 2010 2nd rd pick (SHA) 2011 2nd rd pick 2012 (Conditional if Lagace plays as a 20) 4th pick (LEW) 2010 5th pick (MTL) 2010 Levasseur, 17 Barriault, 17 Gelinas, 18 That is unbelievable, and all for David Gilbert. Patenaude was some smart GM, not!
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Post by lalalaprise on Jan 28, 2010 20:37:35 GMT -4
A sags fan just posted this on radoter... CHI had the 6th overall pick in 2007 they ended up trading it to Halifax and they recieved 12th overall, 53rd overll and 79th overall..with those 3 picks they took Deschamps, Lagace and Rousseau.... Of course this isnt typical but its funny and shocking to look at what they received by dealing those 3 this trade period...this is what they received by trading the 6th overall pick in 2007: 1st rd pick (MON) 2011 (Likely going back to MON for Jodoin) 1st rd pick (CAP) 2010 1st rd pick (LEW) 2010 2nd rd pick (SHA) 2011 2nd rd pick 2012 (Conditional if Lagace plays as a 20) 4th pick (LEW) 2010 5th pick (MTL) 2010 Levasseur, 17 Barriault, 17 Gelinas, 18 Thats some bang for your buck right there. Wow, very interesting. Agreed that's not typical, but funny how things play out over the course of a few years. It would be interesting to follow other deals over the years and how they worked out for teams. People always want to judge a trade the day after it's made, declaring winners and losers, but it's not until a few years later (in some instances) where a real winner can be declared. Guess this goes down as one of Marcel's bad trades huh?? haha. Making it even worse is that 6th pick turned into David Gilbert, who along with a boatload of picks went to get Marchand.....ouch. Well the actual deal of 6th vs 12th, 53rd and 79th is the typical cost of moving up...but who knows who Halifax would have taken 12th and 53rd...i doubt they would have taken Deschamps and Lagace.
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Post by sharrow on Jan 28, 2010 21:34:57 GMT -4
The other sad part of this deal is that David Gilbert went home after training camp. much to a displeasure of the Mooseheads, so I don't think an informed interview took place prior to the draft as well with him.
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Post by lalalaprise on Jan 28, 2010 21:57:13 GMT -4
The other sad part of this deal is that David Gilbert went home after training camp. much to a displeasure of the Mooseheads, so I don't think an informed interview took place prior to the draft as well with him. Im sure they talked to him extensively in April and May...he left in September...a lot of things can happen between May and September. And we all know that agents aren't exactly the most honest people around. Im not sure what Gilbert and the Mooseheads discussed but id have to imagine they discussed his playing time...thats usually the 1st question players parents or their agents ask. If Halifax said he would play in the top 9 forwards and give him loads of ice than they lied and the kid probably left for that reason, but looking at the roster it was quite clear to anyone who followed the league that Halifax had something like 13 returning forwards. Benjamin Casavant was in a similar situation to Gilbert in a lot of ways. Both played on the same Midget team, both were top 10 picks that draft, both were drafted by teams who had a whole roster returning, both players started the season, or at the very least were penciled into their respective teams opening day lineups, and both left to get more icetime... No one seemed to be up in arms over the situation in Rouyn-Noranda...perhaps it comes down to trusting the people in charge, but at the time Halifax fans took it to heart for some reason when it happens often with other teams and its usually and accepted move.
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Post by thecaptain on Jan 28, 2010 22:21:50 GMT -4
Just as a side note to this discussion. Two Mooseheads staff (Troini and Ali MacDonald) were at the Lions game tonight to watch Summerside play. It was the first game they have taken in this yr.
Rumor is Darcy Ashley to Mooseheads is on.
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Post by hfxfan09 on Jan 28, 2010 23:48:38 GMT -4
That would be a good pickup for them he's a good little player!!!
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